Discrimination against women, global examples, vol. 2

Dies ist die Fortführung des Themas Discrimination against women, global examples.

Dieses Thema wurde unter Discrimination against women, global examples, vol. 3 weitergeführt.

ForumFeminist Theory

Melde dich bei LibraryThing an, um Nachrichten zu schreiben.

Discrimination against women, global examples, vol. 2

Dieses Thema ruht momentan. Die letzte Nachricht liegt mehr als 90 Tage zurück. Du kannst es wieder aufgreifen, indem du eine neue Antwort schreibst.

1LolaWalser
Jul. 7, 2016, 9:43 am

File under "Things They Didn't Tell Us" when I was a student:

Nettie Stevens discovered XY sex chromosomes. She didn't get credit because she had two X’s.

(...) Stevens’s colleague and mentor E.B. Wilson — a legendary biologist in his own right — is more commonly cited as the discoverer of sex chromosomes.

The reason is simple: sexism.

Wilson was working on the same questions as Stevens, and he published a similar result around the same time. Wilson had worked on a species where the male actually has one less chromosome than the female, which is less common in nature. Stevens’s model of an X and Y chromosome is the basis for human sex determination. Plus, Stevens’s model better supports Mendel’s theory on genetics — that some genes take on dominant roles and override the instructions of their gene pairs.

“It is generally stated that E. B. Wilson obtained the same results as Stevens, at the same time,” Brush writes. But “Wilson probably did not arrive at his conclusion on sex determination until after he had seen Stevens' results. ... Because of Wilson's more substantial contributions in other areas, he tends to be given most of the credit for this discovery.”

Wilson’s paper published before Stevens’s, and as the man with the higher reputation it’s he who has been credited with the discovery. But even though their papers were similar, it was Stevens who presented a stronger — and ultimately more correct — conclusion.

Wilson still believed environmental factors played a role in determining sex. Stevens said it was purely the chromosomes. Neither view could be confirmed absolutely at the time of the discovery.

But though time proved Stevens correct, it’s Wilson who got the credit.

It’s a classic case of the “Matilda effect,” a term named after the abolitionist Matilda Gage. The effect is the phenomenon that women’s accomplishments tend to be co-opted, outright stolen, or overshadowed by those of male peers.

2elenchus
Jul. 7, 2016, 10:20 am

I didn't know the name Nettie Stevens as I hovered over today's Google Doodle. I'd also not known the term Matilda effect, though certainly I'm familiar with the phenomenon itself.

3jennybhatt
Jul. 7, 2016, 11:52 am

>2 elenchus:: I didn't know about either till today either. The things we learn without even looking. :)

4southernbooklady
Jul. 7, 2016, 2:50 pm

Six women scientists snubbed due to sexism

Aside from Nettie Stevens and of course Rosalind Franklin, there are four others I'd never heard of. I had no idea that a woman graduate student discovered pulsars.

5elenchus
Bearbeitet: Jul. 7, 2016, 3:40 pm

It's a humbling day: yet another term new to me, the glass cliff. As with the others, it is an extremely obvious concept now that it's been explained to me, as though I should have been able to identify the phenomenon myself, regardless of not knowing the specific term.

"Whether they’re sorting out men’s messes, becoming the adult in a room of badly behaving boys, serving as a caretaker, or taking over from an unpopular jerk, there’s another thing female leaders tend to have in common: They’re often presented as a kind of harsh mother figure. "

Sigh.

6LolaWalser
Jul. 7, 2016, 4:44 pm

>4 southernbooklady:

I hadn't heard of Wu or Esther Lederberg--the latter is especially egregious, as I read tons of original papers about phage work, and about its background. The worst is, it's of course still happening. I remember the scandal in 1993 when Louise Chow was left out of the Nobel for the discovery of introns--never mind that she designed the experiments, invented new techniques for them, and performed the crucial work. And the examples are actually myriad, when you consider the majority of research that doesn't end with Nobels and people interested in exploring the historical circumstances and establishing the truth of who did what.

7LolaWalser
Jul. 7, 2016, 4:57 pm


How Wall Street Bro Talk Keeps Women Down

“Bro talk” produces a force field of disrespect and exclusion that makes it incredibly difficult for women to ascend the Wall Street ladder. When you create a culture where women are casually torn apart in conversation, how can you ever stomach promoting them, or working for them? (...)

Men have been inculcated by dads and coaches with an ideal of masculinity and male bonding that includes, and even revolves around, the objectification of women. I knew from a young age that my dad was a “tit man.” My high school baseball coach often talked about which senior girls had the best bodies. In many ways, objectifying women was the rite of passage through which I entered the world of men.

That helps explain why I stood silent hundreds of times as men objectified and degraded women. Protesting would have violated the sanctity of the men-only space, and would have risked interfering with the bonding that goes hand in hand with the objectification of the other sex. It would have been embarrassing and emasculating. And it would have been bad for my career.


Not just on Wall Street, of course. But this here is exactly the mechanism and reasons for spreading contempt of women--it's both why and how we're kept down.

8southernbooklady
Jul. 9, 2016, 3:56 pm

Serena Williams has won at Wimbledon, again.

Asked by a reporter about being considered “one of the greatest female athletes of all time,” she replied: “I prefer the words ‘one of the greatest athletes of all time.'"


9LolaWalser
Jul. 14, 2016, 8:45 am

The perverse effects of misogyny-cum-racism:

College Men for Trump

An ABC News/Washington Post poll last month found that 75 percent of white men had a negative view of Clinton and 23 percent had a favorable view. In the case of college-educated white men, the combined May and June NBC News/Wall Street Journal surveys show a decisively unfavorable, 62-26, view of Clinton.

A number of pollsters pointed out to me that hostility to Clinton is more important that the appeal of Trump in the continuing support for Trump among white college men. (...)

The paradox of Trump’s support among educated white men is that even though a plurality told Pew that they will vote for Trump, NBC/WSJ poll data shows that a clear majority — 58 percent — view Trump unfavorably. That is, they plan to vote for Trump without liking him.

Bias against women in leadership roles often accompanies bias against racial and ethnic minorities and may contribute to the willingness of white men — both college and non-college — to accept flawed leadership from Trump rather than grant authority to women — or to African Americans or Hispanics.


Worst demographic on earth. The sooner "power" REALLY gets "redistributed" from them, the better.

10LolaWalser
Bearbeitet: Jul. 15, 2016, 2:26 pm

You've probably seen some comment about the apparent rash of female politicians LEADERS in the news. Apart from the dubious individual quality of some of those, it pays to remember women and minorities are frequently chosen to shovel shit for others and in effect get set up to fail.

Studies Show Women & Minority Leaders have Shorter Tenures, Tenuous Support

Typical scenario: going gets tough--MAN-IN-CHIEF exits left, right, up, down--some hapless woman/PoC is pushed onto the stage, giant bullseye back and front--going gets tougher, amid shit flying, roofs burning, lizards from hell eating up babies whole and expelling their skeletons through steaming nostrils things get slightly worse or slightly better--the woman/PoC at the centre of it all is meanwhile pelted with frozen airplane refuse and hyena snot--the time of sacrifice nears--a future MAN-IN-CHIEF makes an appearance/comeback--issues soothing noises--adjusts a noose around the woman's/PoC's neck--pulls it.

All breathe sigh of relief. All's well with the world with MAN-IN-CHIEF in office. Until he fucks up the next time.

But that's okay. There are more scapegoats where those ladies came from!

11LolaWalser
Jul. 15, 2016, 2:43 pm

New term for me: "glass cliff". New, and yet familiar!

How Women End Up on the “Glass Cliff”

From the conclusion:

...a company’s leadership history and common assumptions about gender and leadership contribute to the glass cliff. We were especially struck by the finding that the phenomenon does not seem to apply to organizations with a history of female leaders. This suggests that as people become more used to seeing women at the highest levels of management, female leaders won’t be selected primarily for risky turnarounds—and will get more chances to run organizations that have good odds of continued success.


Isn't this interesting? Women (and PoC) receive fewer chances at leadership--and when they do, the chances tend to be shittier, i.e. more risky. And I bet you that, in case they do succeed, nobody notices the bigger leap they made.

Meanwhile, groups that cumulatively receive disproportionately shittier, riskier chances than the privileged group are going to be--as a group--less successful. Voilà, women and PoC clearly suck at what white men excel at! Circle closed.

12jennybhatt
Jul. 15, 2016, 11:31 pm

>11 LolaWalser:: This is very true in the tech world. Every time women CEOs have taken charge, it has been under difficult circumstances. And, when they fail, it's all their fault. Case in point: Marissa Mayer at Yahoo. There's also Meg Whitman at HP, but she's slightly under the radar, I think, because she's been around long enough to know that's the best way to play the game -- keep your head down and don't let them shine a spotlight on you too often. Sad.

The case with Theresa May will be interesting as it unfolds. Let's hope she fares better.

13jennybhatt
Jul. 15, 2016, 11:34 pm

Nottinghamshire county, in the UK, will now consider wolf-whistling and aggressive physical approaches in public places a criminal offense.

"The (police) force now defines misogynistic hate crime as "incidents against women that are motivated by an attitude of a man towards a woman, and includes behaviour targeted towards a woman by men simply because they are a woman"."

Should be interesting to see how this will work. And whether other parts of the UK, or other countries, will follow suit.

I have to say that it took me by surprise. I would have expected such a news item out of Justin Trudeau's Canada but not out of the midlands of the UK (I lived there for 2 years and there is a big blue-collar population for whom such behaviors are a god-given right.)

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/nottinghamshire-police-to-record-...

14sturlington
Jul. 16, 2016, 4:36 am

15LolaWalser
Jul. 19, 2016, 11:58 pm

Woman and girls stabbed by man at French Alps resort

The attacker is currently claiming not to remember what he did and the media, after initial reports that he reacted to what the women (including three girls aged 8-14)--were wearing, are now saying the motives are unclear. Good job, legal counsel!

There have been quite a few reported incidents in France of women getting abused by (presumed) Muslims about what they were wearing, some physical, but not, as far as I know, with this level of danger.

My SIL and a friend visited Sarajevo recently, first time in decades for my SIL (since before the war), and she was shocked by the treatment they got in what used to be a Serbian neighbourhood, and which now seems to have, for whatever reason, oodles of imports from Qatar and Yemen. My SIL says there were women--wrapped head to toe--sitting in front of the houses, and they started hissing and clucking at my SIL and friend. I've seen pictures of that day and both women are wearing totally ordinary getups, trousers and T-shirts. The only striking detail is the friend's hair, which is currently dyed brilliant green (she's the boss of her own marketing empire, she can do what she wants.) Okay, I guess I can't rightly convey how shocked I was by this little story. I spent a week in Sarajevo with my high school class, back in 1986, and this is not a story I'd have thought believable. Sarajevo was open, hip, funny... a normal city like any other, only better in many respects. And not a single hijab, let alone "vice police", in sight. Then.

I have to report my brother's "typical male" first response--serves them well, what on earth where they doing in THAT neighbourhood? Well, they were curious, it had been the scene of the worst battles, they wanted to see what it looked like now, they didn't know about the Qatari (or didn't believe it)...

16LolaWalser
Jul. 21, 2016, 12:14 pm

Korean voice actress fired for wearing a shirt with "Girls don't need a prince" on it. She didn't even wear it to work, she tweeted a picture of herself. The idea that girls don't need princes apparently falls into "controversial topics" rubric in Korea.

http://www.themarysue.com/feminism-around-the-world-korean-voiceover-actress/

Oh, funny story remembered. Well, "funny"... some while back, I'm getting my mid-day coffee break and overhearing because it can't be helped, the two guys next to me, one a bearded guy with glasses and a fedora (yes, really, they are everywhere here) and the other a young Korean (as transpires from the conversation). The fedora tells the Korean guy (whose English is terrible, seems it's a meeting about prospective language lessons), I quote to the best of my recollection, "yes yes you will see, we have gone too far women have too many rights here".

I almost LOLed--it felt like being in one of Kate Beaton's sarcastic comic strips for a moment...

He said next something about lesbians, but darn I was getting up and leaving and lost it in the hubbub...

17jennybhatt
Jul. 21, 2016, 6:29 pm

>16 LolaWalser:: Wow. "Too many rights". I would have been so tempted to go spill a hot coffee on him or something.

18sparemethecensor
Jul. 21, 2016, 7:28 pm

>16 LolaWalser: How appalling.

A few years ago, I visited a cousin who was living in Japan. She told me about a new show, "Lady Pilot," that was very scandalous for... showing a lady whose profession is pilot.

19southernbooklady
Jul. 21, 2016, 7:30 pm

>18 sparemethecensor: that was very scandalous for... showing a lady whose profession is pilot.

Men seem to have very delicate sensibilities.

20LolaWalser
Jul. 21, 2016, 10:00 pm

>17 jennybhatt:

I was tempted to warn off quickly the Korean boy, "you can find a better teacher than this" or, "please don't listen to this fool" both went through my head. If only his English had been better... but this way I thought it would just scare the beejesus out of him and get me into a skirmish with the fedora I simply had no time for. :)

>18 sparemethecensor:

Japan. Okay, Japan is tough for women, we know that. But what would you say about the--nearly exact parallel!--Italian "Donna detective" (from 2007, just checked), literally "Woman detective"? Yes, my dears, the phenomenon of women detectives is still so rare in Italy of the 21st century--even on television!!--they don't need to come up with anything splashier than that bland generic. There's, like, just this ONE show about a woman, who is also a detective, i.e. police-woman. So "Woman detective" it is and basta. What else beside that detail could possibly be important about the show? Why else would you watch it? See woman detect! Ay-mayzing!

Coming up next: "Woman surgeon", "Woman Fisherman", "See Woman Climb Trees", "Woman, Not A Prostitute, Stands In The Street Leaning Against The Wall And Watches Passers-By, As If She Had That Right"

But not to worry, hot babes only need apply.

22southernbooklady
Jul. 27, 2016, 5:39 pm

>21 Jesse_wiedinmyer: Not that I don't think assholes that post such things don't deserve to have their tiny little pricks cut off, but absent any legal recourse, I wonder if there isn't some kind of answer in the model that developed to handle email spam. As far as I can tell, there isn't anything illegal about sending spam email, but there are now monitoring services that will blacklist domains and ip addresses after they receive a certain number of complaints, and most email providers and clients tune their filters to reject or filter out email from sources on that list. And if you get on the list accidentally, you have to jump through a fair number of hoops to get off it again.

23LolaWalser
Jul. 29, 2016, 10:52 am

Tokyo turmoil: race to rule world's largest city mired in sex scandal and misogyny

Women remain under-represented in the halls of power, occupying only 45 of the 475 seats in the lower house of parliament.

25sturlington
Jul. 30, 2016, 9:13 am

A story to turn your stomach. If you have been following the Roger Ailes's debacle, this is the most in-depth story I've read yet on it:

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2016/07/fmr-fox-booker-harassed-by-ailes-fo...

26LolaWalser
Jul. 31, 2016, 8:45 pm

Nice continuation to #23:

Tokyo elects first female governor

Wow, she speaks fluent Arabic.

Oddly enough, looks like she too inherits first of all a mountain of shit, a bucket, and a shovel:

Tokyo has elected its first female governor to take charge of the city amid troubled 2020 Olympic Games preparations...

27jennybhatt
Aug. 1, 2016, 5:38 am

>25 sturlington:: That story was chilling. I'm just surprised that Ailes got away with it all for so long. This particular case went on for 20 years. My God. I have never been in this kind of situation, so hard for me to say. But, did this lady not have any family or well-wishers who would have stepped forward to help somehow? At least, remove her from his toxic influence? Seems like he was surrounded by many enablers and his victims too, like this lady, were enablers.

Why is it that most men who have too much power tend to abuse it?

28jennybhatt
Aug. 1, 2016, 5:45 am

There have been many articles lately that the three most powerful people in the world could soon be all women: Theresa May, Angela Merkel, Hillary Clinton. And, how this could be a good thing, given all the terrorism and economic challenges, because women are more apt to listen and negotiate than want to use weaponry. Maybe there's some truth to that. Along with Christine Lagarde and Janet Yellen leading things in global finance, it will certainly be an interesting new era. Even though Lagarde is facing some legal issues now. Will this be an unprecedented situation? To have a mostly-women team leading major countries and global finance?

29LolaWalser
Bearbeitet: Aug. 4, 2016, 2:14 pm

>28 jennybhatt:

Well, yes, since women have never been much, let alone predominantly, in charge in politics, any situation with increasing number of female politicians is unprecedented.

But I don't think this is automatically some portent of good to come, because I don't for a moment believe women are generally inherently better or smarter than men. (Mainly, I think women are practically "better" because they are less often in position to do damage, and because the double standard penalises aggressive/transgressive women more harshly than men.) And it's notable that most of the currently appearing female politicians are right wing and conservative, or at least traditional political apparatchiks of their respective parties, like Hillary Clinton. Every one of them holds some repugnant oppressive views, has made aggressive, belligerent choices, and/or is mired in scandal. None are notably feminist, none are humanitarians, or pacifists.

That, however, is not the point. As I argued many times before, women will achieve equality not when female saints and geniuses get their due, but when the average female idiot, creep or mediocre politician can succeed as easily and in equal numbers as male ones do.

This uptick in female politicians on the stage may or may not be a symptom of change, remains to be seen--what's sure is that we're far from a real systemic change that would make noticeable any sort of specifically female influence.

30LolaWalser
Aug. 4, 2016, 1:45 pm

OK, this is minor, as discrimination goes, but WTF, it can happen in New Jersey?

Basically, the problem was that she has breasts.

Bina Ramesh celebrated her 22nd birthday three weeks ago at Six Flags Great Adventure in Jackson, NJ. She wore normal theme park attire for 95 degree temps: a V-neck tee and jean cut-offs (pictured here). But apparently it was "inappropriate" and "against park rules," according to a security guard who asked her to change.

Response from the park:

In a statement to Seventeen.com, Kaitlyn Pitts,
Public Relations Supervisor of Six Flags Great Adventure & Safari and Hurricane Harbor, stated: "We apologize for any inconvenience we may have caused this guest. Similar to many public venues, we strive to maintain a family-friendly environment."


And? This girl was somehow upsetting their "family-friendliness", just by being? This is supposed to be an apology? jfc

31southernbooklady
Aug. 4, 2016, 2:22 pm

I think that security guard should be fired since he apparently can't look at a woman without trying to see down her shirt.

32LolaWalser
Aug. 4, 2016, 2:47 pm

It really irks me that he tried to censor a person. Not, say, swear words or obscene images on clothing, but a person's shape, her being. What an asshole. Might as well get tattooed on his forehead: when I see women I get family-unfriendly thoughts and therefore I should not see women, ever.

33Bookmarque
Aug. 4, 2016, 3:31 pm

Ugh, even in my own small sphere - http://petapixel.com/2016/08/04/dear-men-stop-disrespecting-women-photographers-...

The worst part is the automatic dismissal of her point in the comments. That she's whining or she should suck it up because men do (NOT). Some things never change.

34jennybhatt
Aug. 4, 2016, 11:57 pm

>29 LolaWalser:: Yes, all great points. You're right. It's not necessarily a good thing when more women are in power. As with all people, it has to be about what these women are then "allowed" to do with that power (not the right word but you know what I mean) and how they actually choose to wield it too.

And, >30 LolaWalser: and >33 Bookmarque: -- wow. Glad that both women are speaking up, though.

35jennybhatt
Aug. 4, 2016, 11:58 pm

This isn't so much about discrimination as against it, but I really loved that Barack Obama has this essay out in Glamour Mag.

http://www.glamour.com/story/glamour-exclusive-president-barack-obama-says-this-...

36jennybhatt
Aug. 5, 2016, 10:44 am

A terrific essay about The Matilda Effect and more.

http://hazlitt.net/feature/disappearing-act

Before I have a chance to say much at all, he decides who I am. He decides I will be more confident once I have published something in a magazine. (Reality: I’ve won several awards for my long-form magazine writing.) He decides I will be more confident once I’ve given more media interviews. (Reality: I’ve been a guest on CBC’s Q more than once, done TV, local radio a dozen or more times.) He decides I am not confident. (Reality: not exactly, in this moment.) He decides I need someone to show me the ropes. (Reality: I can’t even.) He decides I am young and inexperienced and cute. (Reality: Ugh.)

He decides.

He decides.

He decides.

My vocabulary is reduced to bursts of “but, actually.” He declares the meeting over once he runs out of monologue and I wonder at the new person he’s created for me. Will he smugly tell his friends he helped a newbie today? Will he remember this encounter at all, or will it fizz out, disappear like carbon from soda turned flat? I leave not understanding, but in my mouth something lingers that’s just as tasteless.

37southernbooklady
Aug. 5, 2016, 11:49 am

>36 jennybhatt: But on the outside, my politeness and rage have made me civil. I slip into a familiar mode: watching myself speak with self-deprecating smiles, cringing at the dance that has me receding and him regaining every inch.

A hundred years ago it was "lie back and think of England."

38jennybhatt
Aug. 5, 2016, 10:41 pm

>37 southernbooklady:: Ha. Yes, indeed.

40LolaWalser
Aug. 8, 2016, 10:42 am

Funny!

41elenchus
Bearbeitet: Aug. 8, 2016, 1:38 pm

Olympics Sexism Watch, apparently the first in a series.

I wonder if Slate.com will give out medals for the worst? Maybe it would be better to give out medals for reports which aren't sexist.

42John5918
Aug. 8, 2016, 3:14 pm

>41 elenchus:

And that article doesn't even mention the Helen Skelton furore:

Helen Skelton's revealing skirt sends BBC's Olympic Games Rio 2016 viewers into meltdown (Telegraph)

43southernbooklady
Aug. 10, 2016, 10:27 am

"Wear long sleeves" Health clinics in Florida try to battle the spread of the Zika virus

When Congress voted on funding to deal with the appearance and spread of Zika in Miami, they specifically excluded contraception and Planned Parenthood from the budget.

44elenchus
Bearbeitet: Aug. 10, 2016, 1:13 pm

More Olympics coverage, this one positive. The relevant bits are nearer the end, pondering "pragmatic" reasons for gender equality (as opposed to, what?).

Slate.com article on swimming as a gender equal sport.

45jennybhatt
Aug. 11, 2016, 9:49 am

This book is more about the workplace but has non-work related examples too.

Re. workplace biases: rather than trying to get rid of them, which is practically impossible, the idea is to try to change the system to make it difficult for biases to thrive. For example: avoid unstructured interviews (read article for why); don't have employees share self-evaluations with managers (she says why); and so on.

The article is an interview with the book's author.

"We have to think harder about how we do things. What are our norms? How do we run our organizations? Are they inadvertently biased against certain parts of the population?"

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2016/03/15/why-we-should-give-up-try...

46elenchus
Bearbeitet: Aug. 11, 2016, 12:08 pm

>45 jennybhatt:

I aim to read the article in full, but your description reminds me of the Nudge approach, as described by Thaler. It certainly isn't the only approach to take, and open to criticisms of giving a false sense of security. My take is that it only makes sense to make progress where it can be, and the key aspect I appreciate is I think it supports culture shift.

ETA Read the article, and yes, Iris Bohnet is a behavioural economist, same as Thaler, and their shared subdiscipline underpins the concepts of nudging.

47southernbooklady
Aug. 11, 2016, 8:18 pm

Lesbian couple sues state of New Jersey over insurance-covered fertility treatments:

According to the suit, the women were denied insurance coverage for their fertility treatments because of the wording of an N.J. law that requires women to prove their infertility not only through medical diagnosis, but through unprotected heterosexual sex.


http://www.nj.com/essex/index.ssf/2016/08/lesbian_couples_sue_nj_say_fertility_l...

48jennybhatt
Aug. 11, 2016, 10:30 pm

>46 elenchus:: I've read Nudge too but I had not made the connection of both writers being behavioral economists. So, yes, the similarity in approaches does make sense.

I thought her suggestions and the reasons why we should consider them were spot-on, having experienced all of what she mentioned in the interview. Enough, anyway, for me to add this book to my TBR list so I can read and understand better.

49LolaWalser
Aug. 12, 2016, 10:26 am

It reminds me of the discussions we had (some years ago?) about racism. What matters, as I argued then and would now, are first of all actions, what people do or don't do, and not (so much) what they think. That is, if you want to combat racism (or, sexism) it is more important to push people into doing the right thing, rather than get them "thinking the right things". Of course thinking and acting are connected, but that's the point--it's a two-way connection, it's not just that thinking causes action, action make us think differently.

Change action and mentality will follow. It doesn't necessarily mean profound conviction, specific ideology etc. But that's less important than even a superficial habit of equality. Going by my daily business I interact with dozens of men and a minority, such as blacks in North America, possibly with dozens of whites. If we insisted that every person we dealt with had strong, definite feminist and anti-racist credentials before interacting with them, we'd be condemned to living like hermits. Rather, the pressing point is how they behave, how they treat us, because THAT is the immediate circumstance that restricts our freedom.

If their behaviour doesn't compromise our freedom, then our free presence is available to shape their opinions further on.

50sturlington
Aug. 12, 2016, 10:32 am

Baltimore police violated rights of black men and of women in general, showed horrific bias toward both groups.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/12/us/baltimore-police-sexual-assault-gender-bias...

In six pages of the 163-page report documenting how Baltimore police officers have systematically violated the rights of African-Americans, the Justice Department also painted a picture of a police culture deeply dismissive of sexual assault victims and hostile toward prostitutes and transgender people. It branded the Baltimore Police Department’s response to sexual assault cases “grossly inadequate.”

Baltimore officers sometimes humiliated women who tried to report sexual assault, often failed to gather basic evidence, and disregarded some complaints filed by prostitutes. Some officers blamed victims or discouraged them from identifying their assailants, asking questions like, “Why are you messing that guy’s life up?”

51elenchus
Bearbeitet: Aug. 12, 2016, 1:13 pm

>49 LolaWalser:

I agree with that assessment. Doesn't mean the thinking isn't important, and as you say thinking also directs actions. But seemingly too much emphasis is placed on first "thinking right".

I believe a lot of the Civil Rights Movement's success here in the U.S. is precisely because it addressed both sides. The "message" was to think right (to oversimplify that message), but the interventions and sit-ins and marches brought lots of whites into contact with blacks. Thankfully, it's really hard for whites, even racist whites, to watch a white person beat a black person who is sitting peacefully, or watch white people with ugly grimaces and invective scream at a little black girl walking into school. And then to see other white people, walking beside blacks, without being ugly or hateful or violent. And then, to perhaps stand in a crowd while watching black protestors walk peacefully by. Or ride a bus while black people ride on the same bus, perhaps sit next to that person.

People began to think differently, when they acted in ways they hadn't acted before. Perhaps even despite themselves, despite their intentions.

In a significant way, I believe the U.S. WNT in soccer has done a lot to get people thinking differently, because of how they are doing things -- on the field, and off. The wage discrepancy is horrifically embarrassing, and frankly I think the MNT is embarrassed by it, and hopefully the USSF (Soccer Federation) is becoming embarrassed by it. The Senate has taken notice, though at this point only to make a moral statement: no binding legislation or action yet. But the athletes on the WNT are doing things, bringing people into contact with women athletes, and not a lot of talking about it. They're doing it, and we watch them, and play alongside them, and it's about playing the game well.

52LolaWalser
Aug. 12, 2016, 3:58 pm

"Riding the bus with..." is one of the examples I considered making. Those of us born in diverse environments think nothing about sharing public space, and workplaces, schools up to and including private spaces, with people of all backgrounds. At least as far as one can tell--I have never experienced anyone protesting the presence of people based on their race. This is today the normal state of affairs, regardless of what every individual in those spaces "thinks" about race etc.

But how this came about had nothing to do with changing what every individual thought--it happened and is still happening because those were made and are the laws. And once you have a diverse society that is egalitarian by law, that demands and imposes recognition of rights to everyone, you have a situation in which diversity is normalised to the point of becoming invisible (that is, tending to that point).

The same population that today boards the bus or streetcar with no special acknowledgement that the driver is female, PoC, immigrant--or male, white, native-born--might have, transplanted in time and place, made a huge fuss over this and other things.

Different behaviours that might be due to "different thinking", but the behaviour is crucially affected by situation and imposed rules.

The mobs who'd go to watch a public hanging are still with us, but we did away with public hangings.

53southernbooklady
Bearbeitet: Aug. 19, 2016, 4:54 pm

There's a good article in the New Yorker this week about the culture of sexual harassment at Fox News under Ailes.

To some researchers who’ve studied sexual harassment, though, the Fox News scenario doesn’t look like that much of an outlier. For one thing, some studies have found that women in positions of authority, especially in workplaces that are dominated by men, may be more likely to experience sexual harassment than women in lower-status positions. In a 2012 study called “Sexual Harassment, Workplace Authority, and the Paradox of Power,” the authors—Heather McLaughlin, Christopher Uggen, and Amy Blackstone—found that women in supervisor positions were more likely than non-supervisors to say that they had been sexually harassed on the job in the previous year.


ETA weird - I don't know why the link doesn't work. Maybe this will:

http://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/fox-news-and-the-repercussions-of-se...

54MarthaJeanne
Bearbeitet: Aug. 19, 2016, 5:29 pm

>53 southernbooklady: Your URL doesn't work.

Yes, the second one works.

55.Monkey.
Aug. 19, 2016, 5:16 pm

>53 southernbooklady: I think you may accidentally have a line break inside your href.

58southernbooklady
Sept. 5, 2016, 12:22 pm

"Fertility Day"? What?

59.Monkey.
Sept. 5, 2016, 12:43 pm

Yeah I think it was French news my husband was reading? about this whole ridiculous thing. Everyone is super pissed off. The reason they did it is Italy has the lowest birthrate of the EU (or Europe? whatever), I think he said 1.36 children per woman on avg? which apparently the Italian gov feels is too low, but the whole population pretty much said F U, for a whole variety of reasons, all totally legit. Stupidass campaign.

60sturlington
Bearbeitet: Sept. 5, 2016, 12:51 pm

>59 .Monkey.: All countries should be working to curb their fertility, not increase it! From my experience working at a reproductive health nonprofit, education of women and girls is the very best birth control. Education leads to empowerment leads to women wanting more control over their reproductive lives...

61LolaWalser
Sept. 5, 2016, 12:51 pm

>59 .Monkey.:

The reason they did it is Italy has the lowest birthrate of the EU

The reason they did it is that Italian politics are dominated by fascist pigs, in a country that is already culturally backward, reactionary, and sexist up the wazoo.

62LolaWalser
Sept. 5, 2016, 1:04 pm

>60 sturlington:

The irony is that it's hardly education and empowerment keeping Italian women from getting (more) pregnant--Italy lags on gender equality behind almost every developed Western country.

63.Monkey.
Sept. 5, 2016, 1:09 pm

>61 LolaWalser: Well yeah that too, but the last-place number is the motivation for this fiasco of a day, anyway.

>60 sturlington: Yep, it's still an avg of at least 1/woman, so I was like wtf why are they complaining, it's not like the population is dying off at that rate! And even the Italians who want children are going, um lots of us are jobless and can't afford kids so like, how about no? Then there's those who don't want children, and those who don't want them yet, and everyone is pissed about the gov trying to shove this down their throats, and, yeah. Just bad in every single way.

64LolaWalser
Sept. 5, 2016, 1:30 pm

>63 .Monkey.:

I've been listening to rightwing moaning about Italy's birthrate since I was in high school, at least. There's a backstory to this kind of thing that goes far deeper than shallow acceptance of what some politicians proffer as "motivation" allows for. It has to be seen through multiple lenses, not present as justifiable in any sense because of "motivation".

Don't mean to lecture... :) This hits very close home.

Speaking of home, this is interesting:

http://eige.europa.eu/gender-statistics/gender-equality-index/2012/map

I was wrong--Italy lags not only behind Western countries, it lags behind Poland and the Czech republic. In specific aspects, such as political and economic power (click on "Power"), it lags significantly even behind Croatia, a country with a similar cultural hardline Catholic profile. (Indeed it beats Croatia on a total score by low decimal points.)

This is the world's sixth largest producer we're talking about, not some sinking Pacific archipelago!

Why can't they treat women like people?

65LolaWalser
Sept. 7, 2016, 7:50 am

Research Suggests Women Are Asking for Raises, but Men Get Them More

One common theory to explain the pay gap between men and women assigns blame to women themselves: Maybe they just aren’t asking for raises.

But a study of Australian women has found that they were asking for salary increases as much as their male colleagues — men were just more likely to actually get one. (...)

“If we find that women are asking and aren’t getting the pay rises, it points the finger toward discrimination,” said Dr. Goodall, a senior lecturer in management at the Cass Business School.

The study also examined whether women were reticent about asking for a raise out of fear of upsetting their bosses. The data suggests not: While 14.6 percent of men said they had not tried to get a raise because they were concerned about workplace relationships, 12.9 percent of women said they had held back. (...)

“We didn’t know how the numbers would come out,” Andrew Oswald, a professor of economics and behavioral science at the University of Warwick, said in a statement. “Having seen these findings, I think we have to accept that there is some element of pure discrimination against women.”

66LolaWalser
Sept. 17, 2016, 11:12 am

Less pay, more work, no pension: the 21st-century woman's lot laid bare

(...) The 2015 progress report, Transforming economies, realising rights, published on Monday, said current economic policies and discriminatory laws and attitudes are failing women in rich and poor countries. (...)

Some 77 countries still restrict the type of work women can undertake, with bans on night-time work – as was the case until recently in Bolivia – or construction jobs.

At least 80 countries, including France, Germany, Switzerland, Mexico and South Africa, do not have legislation requiring equal pay for equal work. Over their lifetimes, women in France and Sweden can expect to earn 31% less than men, in Germany 49% less and in Turkey 75% less.

On top of the wage gap in paid work, women on average do almost two-and-a-half times more unpaid care and household work as men. Combining paid and unpaid work, researchers calculated that women in almost all countries work longer hours each day than men. (...)

...while the economic crisis in 2008 had affected the lives of women and men, the resulting cuts in public spending had disproportionately affected women. Austerity measures had “shifted the burden of coping and caring into the household and on to the shoulders of women and girls”. (...)

Barbara Lotti, a programme officer at the women’s fund Mama Cash, said: “The report stresses consistently that social norms are responsible for women’s socio-economic disadvantage in the labour market. Even in countries where formal equality in the form of laws exists, the type of work women perform is undervalued as compared to the jobs that men do, resulting in a gender pay gap.

“It is a big gain to understand the stereotyping of women and the stigma they experience as a crucial factor in women’s access to decent employment."(...)

67LolaWalser
Bearbeitet: Sept. 26, 2016, 5:04 pm

Saudi women file petition to end male guardianship system

P.S. Curious: the top photograph in the article was originally one of Aziza Al-Yousef, the creator of the petition, showing her outdoors, in a hijab but with face uncovered. But when I clicked on the link to see if it worked, the photograph had been changed to a generic one of a woman in niqab getting into a car's back seat.

It did occur to me that Al-Yousef was being brave for letting her face be seen like that, so I can't say I'm surprised the photo's gone, but I'm sorry the removal was deemed necessary... for a moment there I thought hey, maybe things ARE getting better...

68jennybhatt
Okt. 1, 2016, 2:16 am

Disappointed to see the Wall Street Journal publish this op-ed. The venture capitalist who wrote it is advocating that women mask their gender when engaging online, when applying for jobs, etc., to avoid gender bias.

http://www.businessinsider.in/The-internet-is-outraged-by-this-sexist-op-ed-writ...

Yet another version of the pathetic advice women like me have grown up with and spent most of our adult lives hearing. His advice here to women in business is similar to what we were/are told in our personal lives: don't wear short skirts, don't go out alone after dark, don’t speak up/out and call attention to yourself, etc. Because, as always, the burden is on us women and not on the men who can’t seem to restrain themselves from being trolls/jerks/abusers.

Sometimes, I am thankful for the Twitterverse. It gave this op-ed the response it deserves.

Now, he did apologize: https://twitter.com/johngreathouse/status/781584645691289600

But, really.

69RidgewayGirl
Okt. 1, 2016, 11:11 am

>68 jennybhatt: To say nothing about how comfortable white men feel telling other people how to properly adjust their behavior.

70jennybhatt
Okt. 1, 2016, 2:35 pm

>69 RidgewayGirl: Right. At least this one sincerely apologized. Many do not apologize; worse, they do not see anything wrong with their stance(s).

71sturlington
Okt. 1, 2016, 2:44 pm

>70 jennybhatt: I posted about this on another thread. It's great he apologized, but why not also apologize in the pages of the WSJ, where it will be more widely read and have more influence? Why only apologize on Twitter?

Also, I would really like to know what he was thinking when he wrote this. What boggles me is that he apparently sincerely thought he was offering good advice to women. Is he really so blinkered that he didn't realize what he was saying? Some soul-searching as a followup would be interesting.

72MarthaJeanne
Bearbeitet: Okt. 1, 2016, 3:05 pm

But notice, neither his original article nor his Tweets were done with only initials. He wants to be known as John.

Just a historical side note. This advice is nothing new. If you see a piece of music written by 'F. Mendelsohn', don't just assume that it was written by Felix. In fact even if it says Felix, it may have been written by his sister Fanny.

73southernbooklady
Okt. 1, 2016, 3:28 pm

What is curious to me is not just that Mr. John Please-by-all-means-use-my-full-name Greathouse wrote such a wrong-headed column, but that the powers that be let it pass, presumably without comment. I know it was op ed, but somebody must look at these before putting them up, right?

74sturlington
Bearbeitet: Okt. 1, 2016, 3:29 pm

>72 MarthaJeanne: I think that's one of the things so galling about it. Not only was he advising women to do something they've already been doing for centuries, probably, but he was acting like this was a great idea that no one had ever thought of before. I'd really like to know what his editor was thinking, tbh.

>73 southernbooklady: Ha ha, we posted the same thought at the same time.

75Taphophile13
Okt. 1, 2016, 3:46 pm

I remember years ago single women were advised to use only initial and surname listings in the phonebook (remember them?) so that people wouldn't know they lived alone. It took almost no time at all for everyone to assume J. Smith was probably a woman because a man would be listed as John Smith. Just another attempt at the burqa-nization of women.

76MarthaJeanne
Okt. 2, 2016, 2:03 am

https://www.theguardian.com/world/womens-blog/2016/oct/01/celebrity-consent-atta...

About celebrity women being condemned for 'overreacting' to 'prank' assaults by men.

77jennybhatt
Okt. 2, 2016, 3:30 am

Yes, agree with all of you here. I was amazed that no one at the WSJ thought to question publication of the op-ed. And that the subsequent apology was not in the WSJ.

I posted on FB in a couple of groups about this too. It amazes me that this is how men still think. My father and brother, on whom I simply tested the ideas, saw nothing wrong with them either. Grrr.

78MarthaJeanne
Okt. 2, 2016, 3:52 am

My husband said that he would always have considered an application with D. Someone and no picture to be a Diane or Deborah. I pointed out that it could also be Diego, but that confused him.

79southernbooklady
Okt. 5, 2016, 8:39 am

Since the beginning of this thread was about how women scientists are ignored, I thought it would be the place to post this piece:

Why are women finally winning science book prizes?

It's prompted by Andrea Wulf's winning the Royal Society Insight Science Book Prize for The Invention of Nature (which is a phenomenal book, by the way). The prize is for "best popular science book."

But the article has generated some criticism because the writer, John Dugale, seems to be implying that women are winning such things because criteria for the prize has gone a little soft, or has bowed to political pressure:

Wulf’s life of Humboldt is the first single-subject biography to win the Royal Society’s prize since 1999, while Vince combines her personal quest with portraits of lives affected by the plundering of the planet. So perhaps female science writers are more likely to focus on people, while their male counterparts are more likely to address a problem, a mystery or an underexplored scientific field.

80sturlington
Okt. 5, 2016, 8:55 am

>79 southernbooklady: That last sentence in the quote makes me angry. I'm really tired of the whole "women tend to do this, while men tend to this" argument.

81southernbooklady
Okt. 5, 2016, 10:08 am

He does go on to say you can't take the idea too far, but his qualification in somewhat undermined by the amount of effort he makes in showing how it applies this year.

82sturlington
Okt. 5, 2016, 11:25 am

You can't take the argument at all. Some women do things, some men do other things. Some men do the things that women do, and some women do the things that men do. I also hate this whole argument that if a woman or a minority wins a prize, then it's getting soft or bowing to pressure or some other reason than they actually deserved it!

I'm rewatching the reboot of Cosmos with my son and I love the way Niels Degrasse Tyson highlights the work of women and minority scientists who have been overlooked by history even though they made significant finding. He doesn't place them above or below the well-known white male scientists, just places their work on an equal footing with them.

83LolaWalser
Okt. 5, 2016, 11:44 am

I don't follow prizes for pop science, but this chap is conveniently ignoring masses of bios etc. written by men about men and Madame Curie since, like, forever.

84MarthaJeanne
Okt. 14, 2016, 3:51 am

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/black-woman-delta-flight-doctor_us_57ffaefce...

Someone's life was on the line, but the flight attendant couldn't believe that a young black woman could be a medical doctor.

85alco261
Okt. 14, 2016, 11:55 am

>84 MarthaJeanne: One of the "interesting" things about a mixed marriage is that I get to deal with this sort of thing all the time. My wife too is a physician and we've been through this drill (not on a plane but in a public building) as well as countless other situations of similar content. On the lighter side, my wife recently had to go in for some medical treatments and the lady who was checking her in was black. As she looked through the notes she suddenly said, "You're a doctor!?" My wife replied in the affirmative and the lady said, "It doesn't have that anywhere on these records....well, we're going to change that RIGHT NOW!" My wife said the lady's fingers flew across that keyboard and she's convinced every document in that particular computer system now has the appellation "MD" next to my wife's name.

86John5918
Okt. 14, 2016, 1:19 pm

>85 alco261:

I'm also part of a cross-cultural and inter-racial marriage, so I can identify with some of that. And of course living in Africa I am in frequent contact with young black female doctors. Just minutes before I read >84 MarthaJeanne: my sister-in-law popped in to see us - she is a young black female doctor. The doctor I normally see at my GP clinic is young black and female; so is the doctor who gave me my last medical exam for my health insurance.

The doctor who heads my GP clinic is a male Kenyan, married to another doctor who is from Northern Ireland. She tells of how often when they go on holiday to a hotel and he is seen parking the car and carrying in the bags the receptionists assume that she is the client and he is just her driver. She protests vigorously, but his reaction is usually, "Let them think I'm the driver then I will get a free dinner!"

87jennybhatt
Okt. 15, 2016, 12:06 am

>85 alco261:: I love that story. Thanks for sharing.

88southernbooklady
Okt. 18, 2016, 12:06 pm

More good news:

21 girls kidnapped by Boko Haram are reunited with their families

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/missing-nigeria-schoolgirls/joy-21-kidnapped-ni...

The release was the first in what is hoped to be a series of releases over the coming weeks. After last week's release, 197 girls are believed to remain in the hands of Boko Haram; the government says negotiations for their freedom are continuing.

89sturlington
Okt. 18, 2016, 12:16 pm

>88 southernbooklady: Unfortunately, I heard on BBC News this morning that many girls do not want to return to their families, because they face stigma at home. Many of them also have children by now.

90southernbooklady
Okt. 18, 2016, 12:20 pm

I can imagine. I hope the efforts to bring the girls back to their families includes help with reconciling and reintegrating them and changing those attitudes.

I also kind of want all the men in the entire Boko Haram movement to be castrated.

91MarthaJeanne
Bearbeitet: Okt. 19, 2016, 4:08 pm

I'm not sure where to put this, but maybe here is suitable.

This is copied from the transcript of the Daily Press Briefing by the Office of the Spokesperson for the Secretary-General of the United Nations on Monday.

Question: Hi. Some women's groups in New York are now calling for a boycott of the 21 October debut of Wonder Woman as the UN honorary ambassador, so would the UN consider dropping her in that role? And did Ban Ki‑moon sign off on this Wonder Woman ambassadorial position? Thanks.

Spokesman: The project, which we've been working on… which the UN has been working on in close cooperation with UN Women and with UNICEF will go forward. I think… you know, we try from… in our own ways to reach out to the population at large about issues that are of importance to the world, covered by the SDGs (Sustainable Development Goals), whether it's on human rights, children's rights, or gender issues. And I think, in order to reach young people, in order to reach audiences outside of this building, we need to be creative and have creative partnerships. I know there's been some… you know, some negative coverage of the announcement. I would ask for people to wait for the announcement… the unveiling on the 2… later next week.

Question: It… it's 21 October.

Spokesman: It's on 21 October. Sorry. On 21 October and, I think, to judge the project by the artwork that you will see, the commitment that you will see. And, again, I think this is a new and creative way for us to reach a different audience with critical messages about women's empowerment and parity and…

Question: Did… did the… DC Comics, did they pay for her to take on this role? Did they contribute money to the UN?

Spokesman: No. There's no money exchanged.

Question: There's no money exchanged?

Spokesman: This is a partnership again with the UN, with UN-Women, with UNICEF, with DC Comics and with Warner Brothers.

Question: And so did Ban Ki‑moon sign off…?

Spokesman: It went through all the proper authorizations…

Question: So, it went through Ban Ki‑moon's office?

Spokesman: It's gone through, yes, all the proper authorizations. No, one second, please. Go ahead.

https://www.un.org/press/en/2016/db161017.doc.htm

92LolaWalser
Okt. 19, 2016, 4:29 pm

Honorary ambassadorships at the UN aren't that big a thing and they've done purely symbolic, fictional characters before, but in the context of gender inequality at the organisation itself this sure is obnoxious.

Will they at least rewrite her origin story again, away from the abomination that gave her a father, and that daddy-of-all-rapists Zeus at that?

Yes, still fuming over that.

93LolaWalser
Okt. 21, 2016, 5:50 pm

It's not just the Chinese and the Indians--femicide in super-Christian Armenia:

Law to cut sex-selective abortions in Armenia 'putting lives at risk'

(...) In August, the government outlawed sex-selective terminations in response to pressure from the international community and the United Nations Population Fund (Unfpa), which warned of an impending demographic crisis because of the number of foetuses being aborted due to their gender.

Since the fall of the Soviet Union rates of sex-selection have risen in Armenia, meaning that while approximately 105 boys were born for every 100 girls (around the natural rate) in 1991, by 2015 the figure had changed to 115 boys for every 100 girls. (...)

Women they spoke to described the pressure they were under to produce boys. One said that her first child was a daughter, but then she had four abortions before she conceived a son.


This reminds me of what someone told me long ago, discussing the typically very large Albanian families, how it was due to men setting a quota for sons, so the wife would keep having kids until the desired number of boys was reached.

94southernbooklady
Okt. 24, 2016, 5:16 pm

>92 LolaWalser: Honorary ambassadorships at the UN aren't that big a thing and they've done purely symbolic, fictional characters before, but in the context of gender inequality at the organisation itself this sure is obnoxious.


This just came across my feed:

Our daughters don't need to feel empowered, they need real power

Thanks so much for the vote of confidence, United Nations!

Despite an international campaign to finally elect a woman as the secretary-general, none of the five female applicants on the 10-strong shortlist made the cut for the top job. Instead, Wonder Woman has been appointed the honorary ambassador for the empowerment of women and girls.


I've got to admit, the whole piece resonates with me.

95sturlington
Nov. 8, 2016, 9:44 am

An open letter from the women of the Harvard Women's Soccer Team to their male counterparts:

http://kristof.blogs.nytimes.com/2016/11/07/a-letter-from-the-harvard-womens-soc...

In case you missed the original story: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/05/us/harvard-mens-soccer-team-scouting-report.ht...

(NY Times has no paywall during the election.)

96elenchus
Nov. 8, 2016, 10:05 am

>95 sturlington:

Thanks for posting both links, I'd missed the story. Not even sure how to react to it.

97southernbooklady
Nov. 8, 2016, 10:47 am

We should react in the same way we'd react to a group of white people telling nigger jokes to each other. With disgust and no tolerance. Also, the entire Harvard Men's soccer team should have to take remedial Feminism 101 or something.

98MarthaJeanne
Bearbeitet: Nov. 8, 2016, 11:06 am

What still bothers me is that the whole thing is presented as being about 'respecting women'. NO! It should be about respecting people. As long as it is stated as being about respecting women, it remains the underlying idea that women aren't really people.

ETA My husband says he just heard a radio program about a riding holiday. They start with a little training where you are taught to respect the horse. But you still have to be boss and make the horse do what you want it to do.

99Lyndatrue
Nov. 8, 2016, 11:01 am

>95 sturlington: In these days where I've started to avoid the news out of sorrow and disgust, reading the open letter was painful, and uplifting, all at the same time. I reproduce the single (so far, at least) comment below:

This letter is right up there with Michelle Obama's now deservedly famous speech.

Can anyone deny that Harvard attracts the 'best and the brightest?' These amazing women have great futures ahead of them, on and off the field.

Every thinking person, men and women, should applaud and welcome these women and all the other women like them.


Thanks so much for reminding me that there are still bits of the world that haven't gone mad.

100southernbooklady
Nov. 8, 2016, 11:42 am

>98 MarthaJeanne: NO! It should be about respecting people.

For that to happen you have to convince the members of the Harvard Men's Soccer Team that women are people.

101John5918
Nov. 8, 2016, 11:55 am

>100 southernbooklady:

Reminds me a bit of the dynamic I still find amongst many white people in South Africa, where they unconsciously refer to white people as "people" and black people as "blacks". If I point it out to them they get very defensive and insist that it is not racist, and I'm sure in most cases it isn't deliberately racist, but we hope for the day when all people are just, er, people.

102southernbooklady
Nov. 8, 2016, 12:23 pm

>101 John5918: Toni Morrison used to say that Americans are white, and everyone else in America is hyphenated. But in the case of the "scouting report" it's more extreme even than that. The report was a rating of how "fuckable" the women's soccer team players were. That's objectification. Dehumanization, pure and simple. It's why "locker room talk" is not only not benign, it is actively toxic to an egalitarian society -- it condones the dehumanization of an entire group of people.

103LolaWalser
Nov. 12, 2016, 8:20 am

'We are witnessing the politics of humiliation' – Siri Hustvedt, Joyce Carol Oates and more on the US election

Katie Roiphe: The idea of Clinton being “unlikable” has always been a code, a way of papering over and personalising a deep distrust of ambitious, powerful women that extends much further than uneducated, disenfranchised men, which we expect, to women, which we don’t. I’ve often been surprised by the vitriol against Clinton I have heard in ultraliberal living rooms in Brooklyn, the irrational fury at her for some impossible to pin down crime. This feeling, even among educated liberal women, goes way beyond dislike into hate. Even those who are not chanting “Hillary for Prison” and “lock her up” are displaying just how deep our antipathy and suspicion toward ambitious women is. To view this election as, among other things, a sign of white male distrust for female power is to overlook the more disturbing and less understood story of female distrust for female power.

104LolaWalser
Nov. 12, 2016, 9:56 am

Jane Smiley: 'I did not expect the US election to be about women’s issues – stupid me'

Clinton doesn’t have a criminal past. But now the election is over, it is evident that she does have a past, and that her past, whatever it is, was unbearable to the right, because the right has been smearing her for 25 years.

105LolaWalser
Nov. 12, 2016, 11:15 am

‘Hillary Clinton didn’t fail us. We failed her’

For two solid years, the media engaged in spreading half-truths and misinformation about the first serious female candidate for president. For a few days after we learned that Trump likes to grab women “by the pussy”, the mainstream media began admitting how many of the derogatory stories swirling around Clinton were misogynistic, how many were – literally – trumped-up fictions. But then the FBI intervened, and the story reverted to its misogynistic mean, relentlessly informing the American electorate that Clinton is duplicitous, dishonest, untrustworthy. It was character assassination, and it worked.

106southernbooklady
Nov. 21, 2016, 8:04 am

"Please, I am out of options" The murky world of DIY abortions

Martina read through her email once again and hovered her finger over the send button. The message was addressed half a world away to Women on Web, a Dutch not-for-profit group that mails abortion drugs to pregnant women who live in countries where abortion is outlawed.

Martina lives in Texas, where abortion is restricted but legal – making it one of the places where Women on Web refuses to mail the drugs. Still, Martina thought she would try her luck. She had lost her job to downsizing, and in its place she had found only part-time work. Her rent had gone up. Lately, she was borrowing money for gas.

There was no question that she couldn’t afford to have a child. The question was whether she could even afford an abortion.

Martina had an inkling that what she was asking for – help performing her own abortion – might not be fully legal. But she was out of answers. She hit send. Then she began to case the internet for other ways she could cause her own abortion.

107LolaWalser
Dez. 12, 2016, 12:24 pm

One of the most depressing things I read in the wake of the shitfest that is Trump's election was an argument that women supported Trump because, let's face it, "getting PhDs", nurturing professional ambition, expecting recognition, seeking leadership etc. simply wasn't important to most of them, that for most the "ideal" is actually--someone like Melanija Trump. Being like Hillary Clinton, aspiring to those brains and industry, having such ambitions, working that hard, the writer said (a woman, incidentally), just didn't appeal. No contest at all compared to la dolce vita of the well-maintained bimbowife. (My phrasing, not hers--she was reaching out to the demographic.)

Okay, say it's true. Say women value mostly non-intellectual pursuits, appearance, sex, aspire only to low-hanging fruit, marriage, service. The saddest thing? Even in THAT sphere they are getting screwed by discrimination!

How many famous female hairdressers can you name?

I mean, okay--being "the leader of the free world" is admittedly an ambition few can even begin to indulge. Being a captain of industry, top-class intellect, explorer, discoverer requires resources and energies and circumstances the vast majority of us never obtains.

But for fuck's sake. In a field that is (in the UK) 88% female, how is it ever possible that of the NINE nominees for achievement of the year, ZERO are women?

That girls don't have the brains and stamina for maths, science, politics etc. is deeply embedded in the "collective unconscious"--but, what, they can't even cut hair as well as men?

What's the point? That women in ANY profession are allowed to be drudges but not stars. And that even in those super-rare sectors where women dominate both as clientele and workers, misogyny does its dirty work.

108LolaWalser
Dez. 12, 2016, 12:48 pm

This doesn't fit the thread, but as the previous got me all depressed, and this cheered me up...

http://www.teenvogue.com/story/donald-trump-is-gaslighting-america

109LolaWalser
Jan. 26, 2017, 3:19 pm

Girls believe brilliance is a male trait, research into gender stereotypes shows

Taken together, the results reveal that girls of five years old are just as likely as boys to associate brilliance with their own gender. However, for those aged six and seven, girls were less likely than boys to make the association: among six year olds, boys chose people of their own gender as “really, really smart” 65% of the time while girls only selected their gender as brilliant 48% of the time.

The study then explored which gender was expected by children to do better academically at school. The team found that while girls aged five to seven were more likely than boys to associate their own gender with good grades, they did not link such achievements to brilliance.

“Already by this young age girls are discounting the evidence that is in front of their eyes and basing their ideas about who is really, really smart on other things,” said Cimpian.


And this:

...previous research has suggested the low proportion of women in fields such as maths and physics could be down to brilliance being lauded as the key to success.


I think is absolutely true--not that it's the only factor, but that it is an important one. It's packaged into every single popular (mis)conception about "lone geniuses", uniquely gifted discoverers, great explorers. It's everywhere not just in popular literature but in the teaching of science and history of science.

110alco261
Jan. 26, 2017, 4:24 pm

>109 LolaWalser: One possible small bright spot in science/math landscape - to the best of my knowledge, in the U.S. women slightly outnumber men in my field of statistics.

111LolaWalser
Jan. 27, 2017, 1:25 pm

>110 alco261:

Yes, I too come across female statisticians often, but I can't tell whether they are present in force at all levels and functions.

It's probably due to the relatively subdued, practical, "applied science" PR of statistics. Maths and physics--the latter most blatantly, in its 20th century glamorous and sinister adventure story--are saddled with images and narratives of white male accomplishment, albeit at the cost of actively erasing the role of women and non-whites. It creates a psychological barrier and isolates the female student, even when it doesn't discourage her. I suppose it's similar to what a black student might feel. It's not necessarily that you feel outright inferior--but you are aware all the time that you're somehow different, in that set and context, so you keep wondering. And that too is a waste of energy, when compared to the "default" type of student.

112norabelle414
Jan. 27, 2017, 1:59 pm

In college I majored in genetics, and my class of about 30 students only had three men in it. Without much context it would seem that women were very well represented in this particular science.

However, the university was largely an engineering school, and what was happening was that all of the men who were interested in genetics would major in bio-engineering which was part of the College of Science and Engineering, and all of the women would major in genetics as part of the College of Agriculture, Farming, and Life Sciences

113klarusu
Jan. 29, 2017, 3:44 am

Russia decriminalises domestic violence (USA Today)

Another day, another retrograde step worldwide.

114MarthaJeanne
Bearbeitet: Jan. 29, 2017, 4:10 am

Maybe we need to move to Turks and Caicos.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-38679913

(Sorry for being off topic, but I thought it might be good to include some good news.)

115LolaWalser
Jan. 29, 2017, 11:12 am

>114 MarthaJeanne:

Maybe I'm too pessimistic, but there's too much "positive" stereotyping of women in there for me to rejoice. And, frankly, those measures to "boost" men's self-esteem, including commemorating "International Men's Day"... somehow scare me. Given that men traditionally buy their self-esteem at the physical expense of women and all... I fear some women in Turk & Caicos we'll pay for that article with a beating.

>113 klarusu:

Been following that with unspeakable revulsion since they pushed it. And they did it. Utterly disgusting. Putin's Russia is disgusting.

116alco261
Jan. 30, 2017, 2:50 pm

>111 LolaWalser: I can only speak for the places I have worked where we had more than one statistician (me). In those cases women were and, where I currently work, are present in force at all levels and functions. I'm not quite sure what you mean by "the relatively subdued, practical, "applied science" PR of statistics." but, if my experience has been at all typical there hasn't been much subdued about it. If you are going to be any good as a statistician you have to be prepared to defend your work against a wide variety of detractors and naysayers. You also have to be able to take you analysis and findings and explain them in such a way than anyone from the shop floor sweeper to the corporate president can understand what you have said and use them to their advantage.

As for practical - well, up until about the early 1980's, statistics fell into two general categories - beancounting and theory. After the early/mid 1980's the field was rapidly transformed into the applied/theory mix that is standard for most areas of mathematics today. The game changer, of course, was the increase in the computing power of the computer.

117LolaWalser
Jan. 30, 2017, 4:46 pm

I'm not quite sure what you mean by "the relatively subdued, practical, "applied science" PR of statistics." but, if my experience has been at all typical there hasn't been much subdued about it.

I was talking about the general public's perception; nothing to do with the actual business of statistics.

118Taphophile13
Feb. 8, 2017, 6:21 pm

Under a law Putin signed yesterday, "a person can beat his spouse or child until she’s bloodied and bruised, and as long as her injuries don’t require a hospital stay".

http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2017/02/08/russia_decriminalized_domestic_v...

119southernbooklady
Feb. 8, 2017, 6:23 pm

Somebody give his wife a baseball bat.

120sparemethecensor
Feb. 9, 2017, 10:14 am

>119 southernbooklady: While I realize you are being facetious, you may be interested to learn that Putin's wife moved to the countryside and changed her name (as did their daughters) many years ago. I believe he did eventually allow her a divorce.

121southernbooklady
Feb. 9, 2017, 10:49 am

Okay, yeah, I was being facetious. (I once suggested the answer to gun violence in the United States was to only allow women to have guns. ) But it still pisses me off that the "answer" to domestic violence is for the woman to run for her life, instead of the man having the pay the consequences.

122sparemethecensor
Feb. 9, 2017, 11:00 am

>121 southernbooklady: Absolutely agree. Putin's own marital history proves your point though -- as always the onus is on women to get away rather than on men to behave like human beings.

123klarusu
Feb. 14, 2017, 1:45 pm

I was going to try and elucidate why I felt that being considered a 'host' in Oklahoma rather than a person was discriminatory ... but I lost the will.

Happy Valentine's Day.

“I understand that they feel like that is their body,” he said of women. “I feel like it is a separate — what I call them is, is you’re a ‘host.’ And you know when you enter into a relationship you’re going to be that host and so, you know, if you pre-know that then take all precautions and don’t get pregnant,” he explained. “So that’s where I’m at. I’m like, hey, your body is your body and be responsible with it. But after you’re irresponsible then don’t claim, well, I can just go and do this with another body, when you’re the host and you invited that in.”

http://boingboing.net/2017/02/14/oklahoma-lawmakers-want-men-to.html

124MarthaJeanne
Bearbeitet: Feb. 14, 2017, 2:08 pm

Back when Austria decided to allow abortions - must have been in the seventies - the rights of the father/husband were discussed, and it was decided that the woman did not need her husband's permission, but that aborting against his will was grounds for divorce. I never did figure out what a devote Catholic man was supposed to do in this case.

125sparemethecensor
Feb. 14, 2017, 5:48 pm

>123 klarusu: Well there is something refreshing about them being straightforward in their belief that women aren't people. Excuse me while I go throw up, though.

The latest personhood bill not only would ban all abortions and some birth control, it would also prohibit IVF! Because not only do we want to control a woman's occupied uterus, we also want to control how it gets occupied. https://www.bustle.com/p/what-is-the-personhood-bill-hr-586-is-affront-to-women-...

126LolaWalser
Mrz. 7, 2017, 10:21 am

A Secret Marines Facebook Group Shared Nude Photos of Female Service Members

... In an article published Saturday by the Center for Investigative Reporting's Reveal News, Brennan noted that since the end of January, photos of more than two dozen women—many on active duty—with their names, location, and military rank were shared on the page. In at least one incident, comments on a photo advocated for a woman to be sexually assaulted. (...)

Photos posted in the group, which has more than 30,000 members, many using their personal Facebook accounts, reportedly drew plenty of attention, inspiring more than 2,500 comments. According to Brennan, some members of the Facebook group "invited others to collect, identify and share photos of naked or scantily clad service women." Many group members also had access to a Google Drive that included dossiers with women's names and social media information, as well as photos of unidentified women in various states of undress. The total number of photos shared in the "Marines United" group and through Google Drive is unknown.

(...) There were roughly 6,000 reports of military sexual assault in 2015, the most recent year for which numbers are available, according to the Pentagon.

127MarthaJeanne
Mrz. 11, 2017, 3:55 pm

Why doesn't anyone have a sense of humour?

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-39241630

128LolaWalser
Mrz. 12, 2017, 1:14 pm

It must be that curious audio-optical illusion again, whereby one woman appears as five--three of them PoC--to the average white dude.

129MarthaJeanne
Mrz. 12, 2017, 1:17 pm

Well, if she manages to do five times as much?

130LolaWalser
Mrz. 12, 2017, 2:41 pm

Women like that endanger all of us! :)

131jennybhatt
Mrz. 12, 2017, 11:16 pm

That last exchange from 127-130 had me chuckling out loud. You ladies are funny. :)

132southernbooklady
Mrz. 18, 2017, 4:40 pm

US sends delegation to UN conference on women's rights that includes C-FAM and the Heritage Foundation:

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/donald-trump-un-con...

133LolaWalser
Mrz. 19, 2017, 11:08 am

Used to be mostly the likes of Pakistan, Nigeria, Saudia, Turkey etc. one could count on to dynamite progress regarding women, gays etc. at the UN...

134LolaWalser
Mrz. 20, 2017, 12:09 pm

There's no sexism like Gallic sexism... Ever since that burqini bullshit last year I've wanted to have a goodly rant about it but I get too mad to type by the first para.

Enfin! Female author in French school exams for first time

... The modern exam was introduced in the 1990s; the literature option (bac L) was established in 1995 but has ignored female writers until now.

Lafayette’s inclusion is the result of a 2016 petition set up by Prof Françoise Cahen, who teaches at a lycée in Alfortville, south-east Paris.

We’re not asking for parity between male and female artists, we would just like the great female writers such as Marguerite Duras, Mme de Lafayette, Annie Ernaux, Marguerite Yourcenar, Nathalie Sarraute, Simone de Beauvoir, George Sand, Louise Labé … are also regularly the subject of study for our students.

“In classes where there is often a majority of girls and the professors are mostly women, what subliminal message are we sending?” Cahen asked...


That bolded bit just kills me--WHY NOT ask for parity when we're at that?!?! Was she being sarcastic or is it really the abject pleading it sounds to be?

Anyway, I guess it's yay for the foutue belle France allowing one woman's one work as worthy of study in the 21st century.

135southernbooklady
Mrz. 20, 2017, 12:47 pm

>134 LolaWalser: WHY NOT ask for parity when we're at that?!?!

But, but...there's not enough room in the syllabus! Some of the men writers would have to be dropped. People might get the idea that some of those women write better than the men! Quelle horreur!

136LolaWalser
Mrz. 20, 2017, 1:44 pm

Egalité mon cul... BECAUSE of this I'd drop every single bastard they are ramming down the throat of those kids in favour of reading up on Olympe de Gouges: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olympe_de_Gouges

Encore un effort si vous voulez être républicains, messieurs dames!

137Taphophile13
Mrz. 20, 2017, 7:01 pm

VP Pence to be awarded the “Working for Women” honor from the Independent Women’s Forum. (Kellyanne Conway is on the organization’s board and I am sure that doesn't have any bearing on their decision.)

http://www.rawstory.com/2017/03/mike-pence-to-receive-working-for-women-award-fr...

138overlycriticalelisa
Mrz. 21, 2017, 7:08 pm

>137 Taphophile13:

america is an utter satire right now that will result in actual death and destruction.

139LolaWalser
Mrz. 29, 2017, 9:12 am

Cracking open this judge's skull would be but a middling pleasure. A mediocre delight. Nothing to write home about.

Mexican man cleared in sexual assault of schoolgirl because he didn't 'enjoy' it

140jennybhatt
Mai 18, 2017, 11:33 am

Venture capitalists were recording talking about male and female entrepreneurs. Not surprisingly:

"Aside from a few exceptions, the financiers rhetorically produce stereotypical images of women as having qualities opposite to those considered important to being an entrepreneur, with VCs questioning their credibility, trustworthiness, experience, and knowledge.

Conversely, when assessing male entrepreneurs, financiers leaned on stereotypical beliefs about men that reinforced their entrepreneurial potential. Male entrepreneurs were commonly described as being assertive, innovative, competent, experienced, knowledgeable, and having established networks.

These personas highlight a few key differences in how the entrepreneurs were perceived depending on their gender. Men were characterized as having entrepreneurial potential, while the entrepreneurial potential for women was diminished. Many of the young men and women were described as being young, though youth for men was viewed as promising, while young women were considered inexperienced. Men were praised for being viewed as aggressive or arrogant, while women’s experience and excitement were tempered by discussions of their emotional shortcomings. Similarly, cautiousness was viewed very differently depending on the gender of the entrepreneur.

Unsurprisingly, these stereotypes seem to have played a role in who got funding and who didn’t."

Ugh.

https://hbr.org/2017/05/we-recorded-vcs-conversations-and-analyzed-how-different...

141southernbooklady
Mai 21, 2017, 9:03 am

>140 jennybhatt: Venture capitalists might be willing to take risks with their money, but they aren't willing to risk their place at the top of the social hierarchy. A good investment isn't as important as making sure women stay in their place.

142jennybhatt
Mai 21, 2017, 1:53 pm

>141 southernbooklady: Sigh, yes. That is what it comes down to. Amazing though that they don't even realize how skewed and damaging their prejudices are for their their own businesses. Blindness or stupidity or both.

143MarthaJeanne
Jun. 29, 2017, 1:23 am

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-40402084

"Our hotel is not in the right area for single ladies."

144LolaWalser
Jun. 29, 2017, 9:46 am

Ah yes. Travelling/dining out/walking/going just about any business on your own while female... an adventure in itself.

145LolaWalser
Jul. 2, 2017, 12:27 pm

Was stunned this morning to learn that there's a Disney ride (presumably in Disneyland one or another), based on Pirates of the Caribbean, that featured a sex slave ("wench for a bride") auction. I mean, it's been there for... years.

Just take a LOOK at that picture.

Disney Parks Are Changing a “Pirates of the Caribbean” Wench Into a Woman Pirate & Shocker, People Are Pissed

Pick your sex slave out of a bunch of crying women tied with a rope!--100% clean good family fun!!

The kicker? As far as I can tell--they are KEEPING this, only one figure will be dressed up as a pirate... ? what the...?

146southernbooklady
Jul. 2, 2017, 2:20 pm

>145 LolaWalser: Yuck. I may be mis-remembering, but my recollection is that Johnny Depp gets slapped by every woman that gets within in arm's reach. Why wasn't that made into a Disneyland "ride"?

147LolaWalser
Jul. 2, 2017, 5:09 pm

>146 southernbooklady:

Oh no, THAT would be violent and sexist.

/sark

148southernbooklady
Jul. 3, 2017, 10:41 pm

Here's a lovely little heartwarming story:

US denies visas for Afghanistan's all-girl robotics team

I cannot tell you how much that pisses me off.

149LolaWalser
Jul. 7, 2017, 10:58 am

Automation will affect women twice as much as men. This is why

...That's because women are more likely to be employed in jobs that face the highest automation risks. For example, 97% of cashiers are expected to lose their jobs in the coming years to automation. As of 2016, 73% of cashiers are women.

Women are not the only group that ISEA found will be disproportionately impacted by the rise of automation.

Hispanic and African-American workers are 25% and 13% more likely, respectively, to lose their jobs to automation than white workers. Asian workers are 11% less likely, compared to white workers. ...

151Taphophile13
Jul. 11, 2017, 6:32 pm

Betsy DeVos, Department of Education, to address campus sexual assault by consulting men's groups that claim rape is over reported and that women instigate domestic violence.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2017/07/11/betsy_devos_is_asking_men_s_righ...

152MarthaJeanne
Bearbeitet: Jul. 30, 2017, 3:30 pm

I don't know how many people here are following the (soccer) Women's Euro. Austria made it in, and that was thrill enough, with the team hoping to get 1 point in the group phase. They won 7 points and were top of their group. Tonight they beat Spain to make it to the semi-finals. They play Denmark on Thursday. I'm thrilled.

Back a few games ago I watched a short piece in Austrian television about the salaries they get. A few of the women have jobs in teams abroad that they can live off of. One of the top players plays for a 'professional' team in Austria that is having financial problems, so the women have agreed to play for no pay as long as they can keep playing. She said she works half-time, studies half-time (to have a career after football. None of them expect to be able to save any money for the future.) And the rest of the time she devotes to the game.

The various women said that they understand that it is the men's teams that bring in the money. That it's the men's games that fill the stadiums, the men's teams that t-shirts are sold for... So I thought I'd like a t-shirt for the Austrian National team to celebrate their courage and determination. Well, the Austria Football organization Shop has plenty of t-shirts - on sale even -for last year's men's Euro in France. Even a few neutral ones. But not a single t-shirt on offer to support the women who are playing such thrilling games.

Oh, yes, the men got one point last year, and did not reach the knockout phase.

153LolaWalser
Jul. 31, 2017, 9:57 am

Sad. Good luck to anyone trying to change the world of the football mafiosi.

154MarthaJeanne
Jul. 31, 2017, 10:08 am

Still, it made the news today that nearly half of the Austrians watching TV last night saw the women win.

155John5918
Jul. 31, 2017, 12:07 pm

>154 MarthaJeanne:

And I believe the women's cricket world cup, which England won, also had a huge worldwide TV audience.

156MarthaJeanne
Jul. 31, 2017, 1:29 pm

Today they announced that there will be an additional public viewing in front of the Rathaus on Thursday. Oh, I guess people are interested in seeing good football, 'even' if it's women playing.

157morwen04
Aug. 1, 2017, 11:05 am

>152 MarthaJeanne: My favorite "reason" for women's football/soccer not being popular is always the "well the men's game brings in more money".... It takes about a minutes worth of research to find evidence of the women's game being short changed across the world. For instance, most of the African Football Associations literally just don't fund the women's game. OR just after WWI England literally banned women from playing on FA grounds b/c the game was damaging to our fragile female bodies. OR how an article was just recently written about the rules South American players must follow (such as being fired if they become pregnant or if they're gay or suspected of being gay). OR how in several countries across the globe women can be beaten or killed for just playing full stop. OR how even in the USA where we have arguably the best support for the game and the best team (not biased nope ;p) games are often played at inconvenient times and on weird stations. (the EUROS have been available on ESPN3, online only but at least they are available to me?).

There are so many obstacles thrown into the path of the women's game purposefully to keep it from being seen or profitable (much like female superhero movies!) just so they can thrown it back into our faces that the reason they don't give it money or resources is because it doesn't make them money.

However, the game is slowly growing! There are now several competitive leagues around the globe (still mostly just USA, England/Britain/France) but the globe audience for majors tournaments, as you are witnessing first hand, has been on the upswing the last few years. So this is one area I actually have some tentative hope in.

158MarthaJeanne
Aug. 1, 2017, 11:42 am

I don't watch much football, but I find the differences make the women's game more interesting. The women play with more total investment, probably because they aren't as heavy. They are much more likely to throw themselves flat on the ground to get the ball. Fouls happened, of course, but they didn't look deliberate.

And of course (I'm not biased either) all five penalty shots going in, usually with the goalie jumping in the other direction, is some of the most exciting football I've ever seen. Just thinking about doing that after running around the stadium for two hours is enough to tire me out. My husband was laughing at me for my enthusiasm, but I didn't see him leaving the room or telling me to watch it on-line so could change the channel. We watched from shortly before the end of the normal time.

159MarthaJeanne
Aug. 2, 2017, 3:07 pm

This is fun. Already for tomorrow a few men's games are having to be changed. At least if they want to be in television. And should we win ... ! A very 'important' game can't be scheduled until they know whether or not the women will be in the final.

160MarthaJeanne
Aug. 3, 2017, 3:03 pm

Well, the Danish women won. I think the Austrians were just tired. This was another game with overtime and penalty shots.

161Helenliz
Aug. 3, 2017, 4:27 pm

I'm not a footie fan, but I have been hearing about it on the news in the morning. It has been on Today and the sports report this morning was a good 3 sentences in before it mentioned the fact that this was women's footie.

162Taphophile13
Aug. 4, 2017, 3:47 pm

Salk Institute defends itself against charges of sexism by citing sexist norms:

http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/science/2017/08/salt_institute_...

163Helenliz
Aug. 9, 2017, 1:18 pm

164LolaWalser
Aug. 9, 2017, 1:45 pm

Same old crap same olding lo these 27 years of my internet life, with every year bringing us a new crop of uneducated little pricks with oversized egos who'll never mature into human beings. This one may even be too stupid for his chosen profession...

165southernbooklady
Aug. 9, 2017, 1:56 pm

>163 Helenliz: That memo is a piece of work. Not a real deep thinker, that guy.

166MarthaJeanne
Aug. 9, 2017, 2:23 pm

I'm currently enjoying Testosterone Rex which speaks so exactly to those points that it was funny.

http://www.bbc.com/news/business-40845288 is one of the BBC articles on it.

167LolaWalser
Aug. 9, 2017, 2:28 pm

>166 MarthaJeanne:

Thanks for the tip, her Delusions of gender is very good.

168MarthaJeanne
Bearbeitet: Aug. 9, 2017, 2:48 pm

Yes, and I bought this one on the basis of having read that one. In this one she is very good at nailing down why things aren't the same, even when they look it.

For example, 'Men take risks, women don't.'

a) They tend to include the kinds of risks that men take, but not risks that women are more likely to take.

b) Studies show that very few people are likely to take risks in all aspects of their lives. Even people who take risks in one area tend to be generally risk adverse.

c) One US study seemed to show men more likely to take risks than women until they broke it down further. It turned out that rich, white males take more risks. Once you take them out, things get a lot more even.

d) In some cases, risk and pay off are simply different for men and women. In a campus study where students were asked by a stranger of the other sex either for a date tonight, to 'come up to my room', or to have sex, the men accepted much more often than the women. However, another study showed that men are much less likely to care whether a casual partner is satisfied than their regular girlfriend. So risk is higher for the female (social pressure, pregnancy, higher risk of physical damage) but the pay off much lower.

Obviously, that's just the highlights of her argument.

This was published this year, so read it while it's hot.

169MarthaJeanne
Bearbeitet: Aug. 9, 2017, 3:18 pm

If anyone living in Europe is interested in globalization and feminism with a sprinkling of theology, I would be happy to mail you The Oxford handbook of feminist theology. But read my review first. (Put your address in a private message on my profile.)

I finally gave up on it over two thirds of the way through, and I feel so free!
Dieses Thema wurde unter Discrimination against women, global examples, vol. 3 weitergeführt.

Anmelden um mitzuschreiben.