Good Food

Acquiring Annie has me on a steep learning curve on things doggy. The right food to puchase was an early decision, and we've moved to a high protein, no-grain kibble free of artificial preservatives--although it wouldn't be "right" for every dog. Below is the most concise advice of what I was finding online.

abbyful in YahooAnswers: On choosing a good dog food: Read the ingredients on the food you buy. Go with a high quality dog food. A grain should not be in the first couple ingredients ingredient (corn and such are mainly fillers, dogs don't digest it well). Avoid foods that have a lot of "by products" listed.

Here is an article about byproducts:
http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?...

And an article on what ingredients to avoid:
http://www.dogfoodproject.com/index.php?...

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There is no single food that is "best". For example, some dogs thrive on grain-free foods, while grain-free is too rich for other dogs. What you want to find is the high-quality food that *your dog* does best on. (I recommend feeding dry food instead of wet. It's healthier for the gums and teeth.)

Some GOOD foods are :
* Merrick - http://www.merrickpetcare.com/
* Solid Gold - http://www.solidgoldhealth.com/
* Canidae - http://www.canidae.com/
* Timberwolf - http://timberwolforganics.com/
* Orijen - http://www.championpetfoods.com/orijen/o...
* Wellness - http://www.omhpet.com/wellness/
* Chicken Soup brand - http://www.chickensoupforthepetloverssou...
* Blue Buffalo - http://www.bluebuff.com/
* Innova - http://www.naturapet.com/brands/innova.a...
* Innova EVO - http://www.naturapet.com/brands/evo.asp

Or check this website for good foods: http://www.dogfoodanalysis.com/dog_food_...
(I recommend only feeding foods rated 4, 5, or 6 stars. Anything 3 stars or less, I would stay away from.)

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Stay away from grocery stores brands. They are low-quality foods chalk full of fillers, preservatives, dyes, etc.. (Grocery store foods are those like Beneful, Old Roy, Alpo, Pedigree, Purina, etc.)

Beware "premium" foods. "Premium" does not mean good nutritionally, and is not a nutritionally high quality food. It has the same types of ingredients as grocery store foods, just a bit better quality of those not-so-good ingredients. (Premium foods are those like Iams, Eukanuba, Science Diet, etc..)

Another thing to be wary of: A lot of vets will recommend what they sell in their office. They get profit from the brands they keep on their shelves, that's why they push it. Truth is, vet schools don't focus a lot on nutrition. It's not saying that a vet is a bad vet because he recommends those foods, a lot of vets just are told "this is good food", so they pass the message along without proper nutrition knowledge. Also, some dog food brands (like Hills) support vet schools, so vets have heard of it from the time they start college, which makes them think it's good as well.

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Higher quality food may seem more expensive at first, but it evens out. The higher quality the food, the less fillers eaten (and therefore the less poop comes out the other end). Your dog eats more to try to get the nutrition it needs, and most of the food just passes right on through. Also, it will make your animals healthier, so you save money on vet bills in the long run.

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"Big box" petstores like Petco and Petsmart rarely have quality foods. (I do believe that PetCo sells "Solid Gold" and "Natural Balance" brands and Petsmart sells "Blue Buffallo", which are all quality foods, but most of the foods aren't.)

Also, grocery stores and Walmart aren't good places to buy food either.

Your best bets for getting quality dog food are:
- small, locally owned petstores
- dog boutiques
- farm supply stores

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When switching foods, do it gradually. I do this over about a two week timespan:
25% food A, 75% food B
50% food A, 50% food B
75% food A, 25% food B
100% food A

*breathes a sigh of relief* I was wondering when I saw the topic!

I think you meant to post this link:

http://www.dogfoodanalysis.com/dog_food_reviews/

The only brand on those rating pages that I even recognized was EVO!

You know, my vet recommends Iams, Science Diet and Eukanuba. A lot of people can't even being to think about paying $35 for a 15 pound bag of dog food... not with a large dog to feed.

Cost certainly must be an issue, with people giving up their cats and dogs as the recession sets in. I have read, though, and I think I'm seeing it with Annie that dogs tend to need less of foods with less filler. Dogs vary tremendously, of course--one breeder-owner of working terriers report that one of her similar sized dogs ate 2 T (!) daily of Evo, and the other ~3/4 c. And, sometimes one can weigh cost of vet trips against some of these foods: my sister twice was almost ready to euthanize her little dog who itched so bad he chewed holes in himself. A change in food took care of the problem, which, if I remember correctly, was caused by yeast.

I think I've been most amazed by the people who feed their dogs raw meat and bones, a movement sped by the Chinese contaminant discovered in pet food, I think. The other day in another discussion group, one woman was butchering the deer she hit with her car! (It will be a while, if ever, before I could get my head around that!)

Others prepare their own homemade cooked foods.

Oh, dear, this is a topic I have not thought aboaut much recently. I was feeding the raw food for dogs to Nicky when he nearly died of pancreatitis. Schnauzers are known for not digesting fats well. The vet told me to keep him on Obsesity Maintenance diet with carrots and green beans.

I agree that vets are not always well informed about nutrition. But when the dog is near death from eating so called natural dog food...what can I do?

I've talked about cooking from scratch for the dogs but even then there are additives which I don't know they need. After all wild dogs who eat what comes naturally also naturally die at early ages.

Big topic.

#4 - Yup. I think someone has a line of venison and rabbit canned food out. It might be EVO. I actually bought the canned venison for my cat before he passed away, but he wasn't too interested it it. Rosie loved it, though! LOL I would add a spoonful to her kibble.

I agree that if the first ingredient of your kibble is a grain or cereal, that's not a good thing. In the wild wolves do eat things like berries, but they don't eat a lot of corn on the cob. ;o).

Scottie is eating a diet of supermarket brand dog food made of meat chunks in jelly or gravy with vegetables.

She also has a biscuit treat each day and a tooth cleaning chew every week. As a special treat she has a dried pigs ear once a month or so.

And at various times, as and when she can get away with it without being caught, she has grass, unidentified items off the street, things from litter bins, flies, spiders, bits of paper chewed off the more important items of post we receive, things she steals and she would eat butterflies if only they didn't fly up so fast when she chases them.

We did try her on the better and more nutricious dog foods, both meat and dry biscuit types, but they go right through her very quickly and leave her dehydrated and ill. She has a very delicate stomach for the 'good' dog food although you wouldn't guess it when you see her trying to grab a bit of mouldy pizza from the street outside a takeaway before I can stop her.

Y'know, from my ingredients-reading days, I seem to recall that Tractor Supply Company had HUGE bags of kibble that looked pretty reasonable price- and ingredient-wise. Way to much to purchase, though, even if I had a PACK of Annies! She eats 1/2 c kibble a day plus whatever it takes for obedience homework--which can add up when one is training a TERRIER...

Boy, golly, margd, you are right about terriers gobbling up the "training treats". I figure Greta Garbo has me trained! Sometimes she won't come in the house unless I am offering some kind of bribe. And she is picky, too, about her bribes.

"oh, no, you don't expect me to come in for that! go get something good..."

>9 maggie1944: Those terriers! Even as I type, I'm preparing Annie's favorite bribe (er, reward): diced, parboiled liver* rolled in garlic powder and dried in oven. I made it with chicken last time (tiny bits). Another high-value treat is kibble soaked in juice from tinned salmon, oven-dried. I'm thinking I need to develop a diet treat for when/if her metabolism slows--maybe your green beans punched up with garlic or salmon flavor?

I am, without doubt, the smelliest, best-trained owner in class...

*I keep frozen liver on hand for use as needed--not too expensive for small rewards, for most dogs anyway.

Scottie also knows the value of holding out for a better treat.

And she has today realised that by holding up the injured leg and looking at me that she will make me feel guilty enough to feed her a small something every time.

It's true, terriers definately train their owners (slaves?)

Brace yourselves: Nicky and Greta Garbo also love steamed broccoli and brussel sprouts.

Really? I've seen Scottie suck bolognaise sauce off broccoli and spit it back out and she eats almost anything.

Well, if I gave them enough food....

LOL

In researching diets, I came across recommended 'supplements' or home remedies for various doggie woes. Two that I've tried that seem to work are pineapple and apple cider vinegar.

The apple cider vinegar (1 tsp a day, but I just use a little splash from vinegar bottle for my little dog) is said to stop tear stains in 7-10 days. This seems to have done the trick for Annie's white face, although I have yet to stop (and restart) in order to test. One theory is minerals in the ACV, but I wonder if it isn't just improving protein digestion by reducing pH of the meal?

A tsp of pineapple is said to stop coprophagia, or at least consumption of stools of animals that have consumed the pineapple. Cooked pineapple works as well as raw, and so I don't think proteolytic enzyme is responsible. Maybe the fragrance? Seems to work.

Quite a few owners report adding probiotics or yoghurt to their dog's food, which probably makes sense when serving cooked kibble and canned food. Annie's not on a probiotic "program"--I don't know enough about appropriate offerings--but she often accepts a teaspoon from mom's yoghurt.

My naturpath suggested I take apple cider vinegar to help with heart burn and other random maldigestive ailments; when I can stand doing it, it seems to work remarkably well. I use non-filtered, organic acv.

It is a little shocking to the mouth but not too bad.

I add the ACV. pineapple, and water to the kibble. Hope it tastes okay! Does your naturopath allow for your adding to, say, curry?

National Geographic has interactive table on chocolate's effect on dogs: just slide button down to your dog's weight: http://ngm.nationalgeographic.com/2007/10/pets/chocolate-chart-interactive

(Yikes! My dad used to train a poodle of my youth with chocolate rewards! She must have had a high tolerance for the stuff.)

I don't dare change Widget's food. She is 18 - 19 this summer - and still hiking, playing and has teeth & a good coat. I don't know what caused it, she has had a hard life, but my routine for her is pretty set. I feed a high quality food, but not a super premium. She also eats carrots, cabbage (adores and begs for it), and things from the gutter.

#18 Thanks that's really good to know.

Toto (my 18 month Cairn terrier/poodle mix) eats Pet Promise kibble, 3/4 cup with about 1/2 cup of diced boiled chicked and carrots and green beans. About once a month I cook up a pot of Spots Stew which is a recipe that I got from a dog nutrition book. The spots stew is sold in the can, but the owner of the pet food company Halo has the recipe in her book. I'll cook up a batch and replace the cooked chicken with the stew, but always with the kibble. Pet Promise is a no-by product, no meat-meal company and it by far keeps his belly from gurgling and his "business" from being too loose. This is the link to pet promise just for info, and also the link for Halo foods. I buy both of these products at WholeFoods

http://www.petpromiseinc.com/

http://www.halopets.com/

For treats Toto likes frozen peas and carrots, we use sometimes for training. rice cakes (which the Vet recommended when he had a bit of a stomachahce to help settle his tummy, since it soaks up the acid) he also likes bully sticks, Lick Your Chops, chicken and cheese strips and chicken and rice dumb bells. Like scottie, he also tries to eat toilet paper, newspaper, grass, plastic water bottles and whatever bits of stuff he can find on the ground on his walks.

We haven't had a picture of Toto for awhile (hint hint)

ETA: This video may have been extortion attempt. See Message 30 below.

Wellness kibble was an award-winner in 2008, but fellow in this video found sharp whitefish bones in two bags of it. If you feed Wellness with whitefish, might be worth taking a closer look!

http://www.youtube.com:80/watch?v=HB6K2BBd518

OMG, My father-in-law has been trying to get me to switch to that because "it's the best" I keep telling him that Pepper is doing great with what she has and our Vet is very happy with her health and diet, and i'm not going to switch to something else unless it's needed for her health. Because changing foods with her is like a 4 month process of slowly introducing the new food to her.

I changed my dogs to a (mainly) raw diet in 2000, after some years of skin-trouble with one of my Chows.

>24 Mandy2:: Mandy
Never change a winning team ;-)

Kirby couldn't keep anything down when he was a puppy. We tried all kinds of different foods. One day while we were in PetSmart (which was 2 hours away from where we live), a vet was there and we ask her. She said quite a few dogs are allergic to chicken and corn. We tried a type that didn't have either in it, and Kirby could keep it down. It was the Authority Lamb & Rice brand. For about 5 years we would have to drive to PetSmart (which was 2 hours away) to buy him his food. Luckly, they built one that is 30 minutes away from us.

Finnegan was on the Royal Canine brand when we got him. As of last week he has transitioned to the same kind as Kirby, but the puppy version.

Annie's on Orijen (like Evo), the chicken and whitefish recipe. I've never seen anything that looks like a fishbone in this kibble.

omg, diet and miniature schnauzers is a whole book. They have difficulties with fats. So both are on vet fat dog diet kibbles (they are not fat) and for treats they get: green beans, carrots, blueberries, bananas, almost anything I eat that has no fat. No fat.

Greta Garbo does a fine imitation of mountain climbing and gets into any food I leave out - sour dough breads, muffins, croissants, etc. The other day she ate an entire huge chocolate bar = not good! But she did not get sick so we are marching boldly into the future. No fats.

Nicky has had pancreatitis twice and I don't ever want that to happen again.

One time Pepper ate a whole bag full of cheap chocolate candy bars. I freaked out and read the ingrediats to find out how much cocoa she'd eaten. Turned out they were made with imitation chocolate and she didn't get sick at all. Thank God.

The video above showing fishbones in Wellness kibble may have been an extortion attempt. "Alan", a pet store employee and owner of a Yahoo discussion group shares his discussion with the store's Wellness rep (posted with permission). I should have waited a bit before sharing--sorry!

Yesterday I spoke with a representative of Wellness Pet Food, the Rep that services the region I live and work in. He was aware of the video. I was told that the individual that put the video on the internet asked Wellness for money to not put the video online. When Wellness refused the video went up. The Rep said that the company stands on their quality control. I asked him a point blank question; "Is it possible that there were bone shards in the Wellness Fish formula, or, is your company saying this is a case of outright fraud?" The Rep insisted that this was fraud and again repeated that they are confident in their quality control. He pointed out several issues about the video, including the fact that from the distance and angle the bag is sitting on the chair before being cut open, it could very well have already been opened from the back and the content altered. Also, he asked that if there where bone shards loose among the kibble wouldn't you expect them to settle to the bottom and not come up in a scoop taken from the top of the bag? These are both good points.

A short time after my chat with the Wellness Rep. he called me back. He'd spoken to their consumer affairs department, the people that log each and every email and phone call Wellness receives, both good and bad. There have been NO reports from consumers of bone shards in the food. He again mentioned that it is very telling of this situation that the individual asked for money to keep the video from going onto the internet, and that this is the kind of thing any company has to deal with from time to time.

This was all very reassuring. At the same time, my boss at the independent pet supply store and myself are keeping an open mind about the whole thing. Wellness does have a vested interest in keeping their name in the best light they can. If what I've been told is true, I am very suspicious of anyone that asks for money to keep from sharing a concern on the internet. A truly up-front and honest person would not ask for money.

Alan

Forgive me if I am rehashing a topic. Is there a good book for home-made dog food? The ingredients on Halo helped a great deal. 6 month Ben loves pasta or rice with chicken and any vegatable he can get. But the age old question I will ask: Does Ben eating grass mean he has a vitamin defiency? The two goldens eat the same home made chicken stew & I hardly ever see them eating grass.

all my animals (a dog and 2 cats) eat Taste of the Wild. my older cat, Ollie, has had serious health problems that i only recently, through my own research and no help from multiple vets, discovered was diet related. i had always feed higher quality foods, but he can't have ANY grains, period. he almost died because of a blocked bladder caused by the sugar in grains. the vet tried to sell me on Science Diet, but Ollie wouldn't eat it. when i started researching it, i found out that Science Diet (the urinary health one at least) actually cuts out VITAL minerals, minerals that are important in brain function, and leaves in grains because it's cheaper. that was the last straw for me. it may be fine for some, but i couldn't take it any longer.

Taste of the Wild is just as good as Orijen (which i was feeding before) but it's about 1/2 the price. my animals love it, moistened with cranberry juice (which is great for urinary health). my dog, Daisy, is 13 and she is looking better than ever. she's got tons of energy and her coat is much softer and cleaner. my cats wait by their bowls at meal times! Ollie hasn't been sick once in the year that he's been grain-free, where before he was getting horrible urinary infections every 4-5 months. and my kitten, Fig, who's never had a grain in his life, is a GIANT, beautiful, healthy boy!

eta: it's true that they eat a lot less. my parents finally switched to Taste of the Wild for all 6 of their dogs, and they are actually spending almost the exact same each month in food. their Labradoodle, Doc, was constantly itching, which turned out to be a grain allergy. he is a whopper at 85 lbs and he eats less than a cup of kibble each day. their Rat Terrier, Molly, eats less than a 1/4 cup. they aren't hungry and they sure are healthier!