Kidzdoc Strives for Insanity in 2024 (3)

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Kidzdoc Strives for Insanity in 2024 (3)

1kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Mai 29, 10:18 am



I think we're past the need for introductions, right? If not, please refer to one of my previous 2024 threads.

Currently reading:

    

Yellowface by R.F. Kuang
The Song of the Cell: An Exploration of Medicine and the New Human by Siddhartha Mukherjee
Leaves from the Notebook of a Tamed Cynic by Reinhold Niebuhr
Self-Care for Black Men: 100 Ways to Heal and Liberate by Jor-El Caraballo, LMHC

January:
1. The House of Doors by Tan Twan Eng
2. The Upcycled Self: A Memoir on the Art of Becoming Who We Are by Tariq "Black Thought" Trotter
3. The Hundred Years' War on Palestine: A History of Settler Colonialism and Resistance, 1917-2017 by Rashid Khalidi

February:

March:
4. An Unquiet Mind: A Memoir of Moods and Madness by Kay Redfield Jamison

April:
5. Bipolar Disorder: A Guide for You & Your Loved Ones, 4th Edition by Francis Mark Mondimore, MD
6. The Details by Ia Genberg
7. What I'd Rather Not Think About by Jente Posthuma
8. Crooked Plow by Itamar Vieria Junior

May:
9. The Heart: Frida Kahlo in Paris by Marc Petitjean
10. Black AF History: The Un-whitewashed Story of America by Michael Harriott
11. Let Us Descend by Jesmyn Ward
12. Medgar & Myrlie: Medgar Evers and the Love Story That Awakened America by Joy-Ann Reid
13. Travelers to Unimaginable Lands: Stories of Dementia, the Caregiver, and the Human Brain by Dasha Kiper (DNF)
14. My Father's Brain: Life in the Shadow of Alzheimer's by Sandeep Jauhar

2kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Mai 17, 11:52 am



The African Diaspora: Fiction and Poetry

Crooked Plow by Itamar Vieria Junior
Let Us Descend by Jesmyn Ward

3kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Mai 25, 11:20 am

4kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Apr. 30, 3:30 pm

2024 International Booker Prize Longlist:

Crooked Plow by Itamar Vieria Junior
The Details by Ia Genberg
What I'd Rather Not Think About by Jente Posthuma

2024 Booker Prize Longlist: TBA

5kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Mai 11, 12:23 pm



Dignidad Literaria: Literature and Nonfiction by Authentic Latinx Writers

Crooked Plow by Itamar Vieria Junior

6kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Mai 28, 8:28 pm

7kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Apr. 11, 3:11 pm

Philosophy & Religion

8kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Apr. 11, 3:12 pm

9kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Apr. 11, 3:12 pm



This thread is open for business!

10kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Apr. 14, 6:27 pm

Book #6: The Details by Ia Genberg, translated from the Swedish by Kira Josefsson

  

My rating:

Up until that evening I'd always maintained that humans are basically rational, that behavior in general is motivated by calculations, whether simple or complex, conscious or misguided or inscrutable, but calculations nevertheless, and that there's some kind of intention in there about reaping, or advantage, about happiness, pleasure, joy maybe; that there's a kind of will humans are pretty much set to follow since they are basically wise, since they seek the best for themselves and sometimes also others. But when I knocked on that door, regarding my own knuckles—which were dried and chapped from the fall weather but warm from the night—next to the handwritten sign saying backstage + crew, I realized I'd been wrong, that it is only after the fact that we attach these calculations to our impulses, to the mad wild dogs that actually run our lives.

The unnamed narrator of this novel is a middle aged woman who is experiencing an illness with high fevers and fatigue, which confines her to bed for several days. In the midst of her illness she recalls and revisits Paul Auster's The New York Trilogy, which was given to her by Johanna, a lover from her past who has found fame as a well known radio broadcaster. The book consists of four characters who have been integral to the life of the narrator: Niki, her roommate in college, who the narrator attempted to befriend while being repeatedly ignored and pushed away; Alejandro, a lover who was a member of a local rock band; and Birgitte, her mother, who had to overcome her own demons after the birth of her children. Each character is somewhat inscrutable in her or his own way, although the narrator’s life was greatly impacted by each of them.

I found The Details to be a lovely novel to read, but its ethereal nature and structure means that it neither it nor its characters will stay with me long, and I would be very surprised if it wins the International Booker Prize.

11kjuliff
Apr. 11, 3:36 pm

Re this year’s International Booker shortlist - I can’t get enthusiastic about this year’s selections.i’ve read Kairos and I think it’ll win. But none of the others on the shortlist are available on audio, except The Details which doesn’t interest me. Looking forward though to your reviews.

12kidzdoc
Apr. 11, 3:43 pm

>11 kjuliff: I just finished my review of The Details in >10 kidzdoc:. I'm halfway through What I'd Rather Not Think About by Jente Posthuma, and I'm enjoying it considerably more. Next up will be Kairos, which I have on my Kindle.

13kjuliff
Apr. 11, 3:57 pm

>12 kidzdoc: Kairos is good. My bet is that it will win as Erpenbeck is due for an IB. Though I don’t think Kairos is her best. I don’t think I want to buy The Details as it sounds a but mediocre. None of the LT member reviews - yes I read yours - alter my impression.

I look forward to your Kairos review.

14labfs39
Apr. 11, 4:24 pm

Happy new thread, Darryl. Nice review of The Details.

15Berly
Apr. 11, 4:30 pm

Happy new one, Darryl. Thanks for the review of The Details, but it's not drawing me in. Hope your day is a good one. : )

16jessibud2
Apr. 11, 5:07 pm

Happy new thread, Darryl

17FAMeulstee
Apr. 12, 3:31 am

Happy new thread, Darryl!

I just got What I'd Rather Not Think About from the library. I hope to read it later this month. Reading is rather slow at the moment, so it might have to wait until early May.

18bell7
Apr. 13, 8:48 pm

Happy new thread, Darryl!

19kidzdoc
Apr. 14, 4:08 pm

>13 kjuliff: I wouldn't recommend purchasing The Details, Kate; I knocked down my rating to 3 stars. I've decided to wait on reading Kairos for the moment, and I started Let Us Descend by Jasmyn Ward as my fictional read, alongside Black AF History: The Un-whitewashed Story of America by Michael Harriot, and Self-Care for Black Men: 100 Ways to Heal and Liberate by Jor-El Caraballo, LMHC.

I finished What I'd Rather Not Think About by Jente Posthuma this morning, which was a much better read than The Details, IMO. I'll review it shortly, so that I can return it, The Details, and The House on Via Gemito to my nearest branch of the Free Library of Philadelphia tomorrow or Tuesday. I'm still waiting for the print copy of Crooked Plow that I had requested, along with the electronic edition of Mater 2-10.

>14 labfs39:, >15 Berly:, >16 jessibud2:, >17 FAMeulstee:, >18 bell7: Thanks, Lisa, Kim, Shelley, Anita, and Mary!

20kjuliff
Apr. 14, 4:32 pm

>19 kidzdoc: Yes, I’m not going to purchase The Details. I’ve read a couple of very good books lately and am having difficulty concentrating on anything that doesn’t measure up. I barely managed to finish The Kitchen after having read The Trees and We Die Alone which were both excellent and kept me enthralled. I think you will enjoy Kairos.

21kidzdoc
Apr. 14, 4:53 pm

>20 kjuliff: Sounds good, Kate. I'm looking forward to Kairos, as I loved two of her earlier novels, Visitation, and Go, Went, Gone.

22kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Apr. 14, 6:23 pm

Book #7: What I'd Rather Not Think About by Jente Posthuma, translated from the Dutch by Sarah Timmer Harvey

 

Shortlisted for the 2024 International Booker Prize

My rating:

Apologies in advance, but I found these three quotes to be particularly touching and poignant, especially the first one:

I thought about all the love we have inside us and how only a shred of that reaches the people we care about.

My brother believed that all misery began with hope. Or maybe not all misery, he said, but certainly a lot of it. You shouldn't believe that things will get better. As a child you have to make do with what you have, parents who are never around and a sister that is always there, whining.

My brother's life was a series of poor 'Survivor' decisions but the stupidest thing he did was break his alliance with the only other contestant he could trust, the one who would have given him her last grains of rice, who would have carried him on her back to the finish line if it came to that.

This short novel is narrated by an unnamed young woman who has a twin sibling born 45 minutes before she was, but treats her as a younger sister, who he casually refers to as Two. Both twins suffered from a difficult childhood, due to emotionally distant parents that provided for them financially but not spiritually, and that combined with the older twin's difficulty fitting in throughout his school years and his early adulthood led him to have frequent thoughts of suicide, while pushing away his sister, the only person who loved him unconditionally and completely. His sister bore her own emotional trauma from her childhood years, but she wanted nothing more than her brother to live, and to be happy doing so, but her brother found her repeated efforts to help him to be suffocating and crippling.

Each of the twins had unusual fascinations, with the reality television show Survivor, with the infamous Nazi physician Josef Mengele, the "Angel of Death" who performed experiments on the first born of pairs of twins, and survivors of concentration camps, even though none of their relatives were even in any.

The novel consists of very short snapshots, some as short as a sentence or two, which provide a glimpse into each twin in a nonlinear fashion, both during the childhood and young adulthood, his suicide, and how deeply his sister's life was affected, years after her brother died of suicide.

What I'd Rather Not Think About is a tragic story, in which the superhuman efforts of one sibling to save the life of another proves fruitless, but it is also filled with small segments of wry humor that keep it from being a morbidly depressing one. Unlike The Details I found this novel to be a worthy choice for this year's International Booker Prize.

23dianelouise100
Apr. 14, 5:37 pm

I think that if any book stands a chance against Kairos, it will be Crooked Plow—not that I’ve read any others on the Short List (lol). At 2/3 of the way thru, though, I’m so impressed by Crooked Plow that I’ll be rooting for it. I’d like to find What I’d Rather not Think About and I have a copy of The Details, but based on your reviews, think I’ll be better off reading Posthuma and/or Erpenbeck. What about Not a River?

24kidzdoc
Apr. 14, 6:21 pm

>23 dianelouise100: From what I can tell, Not a River won't be published in the US until May 7th, at least that's what Amazon says.

25Sakerfalcon
Apr. 17, 7:54 am

Happy new thread Darryl! Two books read - that's cause for celebration! I'm also not especially excited by this year's IB list, so I will wait for more reviews from readers I trust like yourself before I purchase any.

26tangledthread
Apr. 18, 7:40 am

Happy new thread! I have Kairos on my kindle, but haven't been able to settle into it.
Thanks for the reviews.

27kidzdoc
Apr. 19, 6:18 pm

>25 Sakerfalcon: Thanks, Claire. Three books in half a month is the best I've done in quite some time, and I hope that it's a reflection of a much better reading year to come.

I just say that the copy of Crooked Plow I requested from the Free Library of Philadelphia is now available, so I'll fetch it sometime tomorrow.

>26 tangledthread: Thanks, tangledthread. I'll wait to start Kairos until after I read Let Us Descend and Crooked Plow.

28dianelouise100
Apr. 20, 8:20 am

I loved Crooked Plow, will be interested to see what you think. And thanks for reviewing The Details and What I’d Rather Not Think About.
I have access to both, and expect to read The Details last of the SL—but your review makes me think it is worth reading.

29kidzdoc
Apr. 30, 3:39 pm

>28 dianelouise100: I finally finished Crooked Plow this afternoon, and I thought that it was superb. I'll give it 4½ stars, and rank it just ahead of What I'd Rather Not Think About in my rank order of this year's International Booker Prize shortlist:

1. Crooked Plow by Itamar Vieira Junior
2. What I'd Rather Not Think About by Jente Posthuma
3. The Details by Ia Genberg

It's certainly possible that I could finish the shortlist by April 21st, the date of the prize announcement. I have Kairos on my Kindle, I'm waiting for the copy of Mater 2-10 I requested from the Free Library of Philadelphia to become available, and I'll likely purchase the Kindle edition of Not a River.

30dianelouise100
Apr. 30, 4:51 pm

>29 kidzdoc: I’ve finished What I’d Rather Not Think About and didn’t read the Details. I’ve started Mater 2-10, which you certainly have to credit for its unique set-up. I’m not far enough into it to really have a feel for it. Agreeing with you on the rankings.

31kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Mai 2, 6:55 pm

>30 dianelouise100: Sounds good, Diane. It doesn't seem as though I'll get to Mater 2-10 before the winner is announced on the 21st unless I purchase it, as the copy in the Free Library of Philadelphia is already checked out, and there is one person who'll get it before I do. I may decide to postpone reading it unless it does win.

I'm mainly reading The Heart: Frida Kahlo in Paris by Marc Petitjean, a book I bought in The Met Store in the Metropolitan Museum of Art in late March, which covers the period in early 1939 in which she was encouraged by André Breton and her husband, Diego Rivera, to travel abroad, for slightly different reasons: Breton thought that she was the epitome of surrealism, and wanted her art to be displayed in Europe; Rivera also thought it was a good idea to gain exposure abroad, after a very successful solo exhibition in the Julien Levy gallery in NYC, but he was also having an affair with Frida's sister Cristina and wanted to do so without guilt, while openly contemplating whether he should divorce her or not. It's quite good so far, and I'll probably finish it this weekend. Frida Kahlo is easily in my list of top 5 favorite artists, along with Pablo Picasso, Salvador Dalí, Joan Miró and Juan Gris (yeah, there is clearly a common theme here...).

Having said that, Frida Kahlo is, IMO, the most interesting artist of the 20th century, along with one of the most interesting people, period.

32dianelouise100
Mai 2, 7:58 pm

>31 kidzdoc: I read about 100 pages of Mater 2-10 (I bought the Kindle edition) and laid it aside. It just didn’t grab me, though I may try it again at some point. I’d be surprised if it were the winner, which I realize is presumptuous to say based on only 20% of the book.

33RidgewayGirl
Mai 2, 9:14 pm

>31 kidzdoc: Since you're a fan of surrealism, take a look a Remedios Varo. I had never heard of her until the Art Institute did an exhibition of her work and I fell in love with her weird outlook.

PS NOLA was amazing. I put a few pictures up on my thread.

34labfs39
Mai 3, 7:32 am

>31 kidzdoc: As you know, I'm homeschooling my nieces, and two of the artists we studied last year were Frida Kahlo and Joan Miró. I hadn't known much about their art before then. I am learning so much while purportedly teaching them!

35japaul22
Mai 3, 7:41 am

>33 RidgewayGirl: I saw the Remedios Varo exhibit when I was in Chicago this fall and also LOVED it. Really striking and memorable.

36Sakerfalcon
Mai 3, 8:59 am

>33 RidgewayGirl: I love Varo, and was soooo tempted to try and come to Chicago for the exhibition. But it wasn't really feasible to come from London. I will travel to mainland Europe for exhibitions, but the US is a bit too far! I also love Leonora Carrington (who also had a very interesting life) and Leonor Fini.

37Caroline_McElwee
Mai 4, 9:27 am

>36 Sakerfalcon: Leonora Carrington fan here too Claire. As well as Frieda.

38kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Mai 4, 1:25 pm

>32 dianelouise100: Yeah, I have a feeling that I won't be getting to Mater 2-10 unless it wins the International Booker Prize, as I'm trying to avoid purchasing books that I don't want in my library. I'll definitely read Kairos and Not a River, though.

>33 RidgewayGirl: Thanks for recommending Remedios Varo to me, Kay! I had not heard of her, and I see that there is an exhibition of her work this month at the Adler Beatty gallery in NYC from May 8 through June 1. With any luck either my cousin can visit us that month, or I can take a train into the city for a quick visit on a day that I send my mother to the adult daycare center.

ArtNet: Long Overlooked Surrealist Remedios Varo Gets Her First New York Show in Four Decades

CNN: Why Remedios Varo, one of the ‘three witches’ of surrealism, continues to fascinate

Okay, I'm curious: who are the 'three witches' of surrealism? Varo, presumably Kahlo, who else? No, it's actually Varo, fellow painter Leonora Carrington, and photographer Kati Horna. None of them seemed to win much recognition, especially since Kahlo or Carrington, as they each died at relatively young ages.

>34 labfs39: That's great, Lisa! There was a fabulous exhibition of Frida Kahlo's work at the Philadelphia Museum of Art in 2008, which is where I learned more about her. I've visited the Fundació Joan Miró in Barcelona at least three times and seen his work in modern art museums in the United States and Europe other times since then.

>35 japaul22: Thanks for mentioning that, Jennifer. The few paintings by Varo I've seen just now are striking and inspiring. I'll have to go back through photos I've taken from art museums I've visited to see if there are any which feature her work. I don't take a lot of photos, only the ones that move me the most, but I do take pictures of the cards that list the name of the artist and the work, for future reference.

>36 Sakerfalcon:, >37 Caroline_McElwee: Thanks, Claire and Caroline. I'm sure that I've seen some of Leonora Carrington's work, especially in Tate Modern and MoMA, but I'll look for her works in my phone's gallery as well.

39benitastrnad
Mai 4, 7:38 pm

I also like Joan Miro's work. Seven years ago I was attending a local art festival and ran across a potter who had lots of designs "in the style of" Miro. I fell in love with them. I splurged and purchased a long narrow platter and a bowl. I used that platter so much that the next year I looked for that potter but didn't find him until late on the last day. He had not had a good show and didn't want to pack up all his stuff. He offered me another bowl, platter, and a shallow boat shaped bowl for $120.00. I didn't haggle with him and purchased all of them. I use them regularly and each time I do they make me smile. The long narrow platters are perfect for rice based dishes and salads so they get used over and over.

The ceramic clay the potter used is black and the glazes are white, a bluish tinted grey and black for the underside of the vessels. Each one is decorated with a combination of red and yellow dots and black lines on the white background glaze. They are just so happy looking. They are one of the best purchases I ever made.

I have never seen a Miro work in real life but when I am able I intend to hunt them down in art museum's and study them. I hope to go to Barcelona someday and see them in their home environment.

40benitastrnad
Mai 4, 7:43 pm

I went out of my comfort zone today and went to a huge Mexican market/grocery in the south part of Birmingham. (suburb named Pelham.) They have a grocery items and an cold drinks bar, bakery, and a buffet for lunch and supper. I spent about an hour looking at all the fruit and vegetables in the produce section then looked closely at the butcher shop items. I purchased some baked goods and then ate at the buffet. It was great fun and I do have to say that I have not seen as large of a selection of peppers, dried and fresh, since I did my grocery shopping in Dodge City, KS. The place was a bit crowded and I suspect that was because many people were doing their shopping for parties and such for tomorrow. I purchased and ate one of those wonderful Mexican popsicles before I left. This is a store I will go back to at some point.

41lisapeet
Mai 5, 8:35 am

One thing my parents did that I'll be forever thankful for was to expose me to a lot of art and literature early, and Miró was probably my favorite artist when I was... four? Five? If you think of it, his work is so suited to little kids and the way they can get lost in images, light against dark, etc. I remember having a big jigsaw puzzle of one of his works that I liked to do. I was a funny little kid.

Also a fan of Carrington and Varo, and of course Kahlo. A few years back New York Botanical Garden recreated parts of her Casa Azul—with, of course, all the native plant life, which was spectacular. That was a great exhibit, and made me want to travel to Mexico to see the original.

42labfs39
Mai 5, 11:43 am

>41 lisapeet: I agree that Miró is accessible for kids. My nieces (then aged 3 and 6) and I studied some of his works and then created our own pieces in his style. Very fun. We hung them up in our "gallery", alongside those of other artists we had studied.

43kidzdoc
Mai 6, 4:24 pm

>39 benitastrnad: Well done on supporting that ceramic artist, Benita. Miró's best works also make me smile and lift my spirits, and after going at least three times to the Fundació Joan Miró in Barcelona, the museum that is dedicated to his work and subsequent artists who were influenced by him, I have a greater understanding and appreciation of the parti cular elements of his paintings. He was a prolific artist, so hopefully you'll be able to see at least one of his works in a major museum; the Museum of Modern Art definitely has a couple of his paintings, but IIRC the Metropolitan Museum of Art does as well.

"Ciphers and Constellations in Love with a Woman" is one of my favorites:



Yes, do go to Barcelona! There are several great museums there; my favorites, in addition to the Fundació Joan Miró, are the Museu Nacional d'Art de Catalunya, the national art museum of Catalunya (Catalonia); the Museu Picasso, which focuses on his works towards the beginning (pre-Cubist) and end of his career; the Museu d'Art Contemporani, the contemporary art museum; and the Museu d'Història de Barcelona, which is specifically about Barcelona. The architecture there is absolutely stunning, and the highlight in 2026 will be the expected completion of La Sagrada Família, on the 100th anniversary of the death of the famed architect Antoni Gaudí. I want to see it, having visited the church twice, but I probably won't go before 2027.

>40 benitastrnad: I love going to markets and stores that cater to different ethnic groups, so I'm glad that you had a good experience in that mercado.

>41 lisapeet: That was great that your parents exposed you to Miró and other artists at a young age, Lisa! There were plenty of kids who were enjoying the art whenever I visited the Fundació Joan Miró, and I seem to remember several of them enjoying Picasso's sculptures during a recent exhibition of them at either MoMA or Tate Modern.

Ooh, that re-creation of Casa Azul must have been amazing...

>42 labfs39: That's a great project, Lisa!

44kidzdoc
Mai 6, 5:04 pm

Book #8: Crooked Plow by Itamar Vieira Junior, translated by Johnny Lorenz



My rating:

This novel, which is currently on this year's International Booker Prize shortlist and has won several awards in Brasil and Portugal, is set in the interior of the state of Bahia, several generations after the freedom of slaves from Africa in 1888. The former slaves are generally "employed" as tenant farmers, who are allowed to build flimsy mud shacks on the properties of the plantation owners, but are not allowed to own property or build sturdier brick homes. They harvest their own plots, but much of the best harvest is taken from them by the owners and their White overseers, as they deem that the harvest belongs to them, and the farmers are forced to purchase goods from the owners at exorbitant prices. (Hmm, does this sound familiar?)

The story opens with two young sisters, Bibiana and Belonísia, who have discovered a stunning ivory handled knife in the suitcase of their grandmother Donana, which is wrapped in an old rag. The sisters are each fascinated by the knife and want to taste it immediately. Each pulls on the knife, and in doing so suffer extreme cuts to their tongue, with a complete amputation of one of the organs and a serious injury to the other one. Because of their impoverished status and distance from major cities neither is able to receive adequate medical care. The sister with the least grevious injury is eventually able to regain speech, and the two remain close and able to communicate to each other.

The sisters form the basis of this intriguing and often tragic tale about the hard lives of these quilombolas, descendants of Afro-Brasilian slaves who, like their African American counterparts, suffered from extreme racism and violence if they dared stand up for their rights as Brasilian citizens. The women suffer the most, at the hands of unfaithful and often violent men who exert their frustrations on them. The novel is filled with great beauty, though, with magical realism sprinkled throughout, and as their conditions improve, their hopes for better lives do as well.

I greatly enjoyed Crooked Plow, which so far is my favorite of the three books I’ve read from this year’s International Booker Prize shortlist. The author, Itamar Vieira Junior, is of Afro-Brasilian descent with a doctorate in Ethnic and African Studies and has studied the quilombola communities extensively, so he is quite knowledgeable about the people he writes about.

45kidzdoc
Mai 7, 3:50 pm

Book #9: The Heart: Frida Kahlo in Paris by Marc Petitjean, translated by Adriana Hunter

 

My rating:

Jacqueline describes an animated private viewing, but with an isolated Frida, alone in a corner. "She was not the sort of artist who was anxious to exhibit or discuss her paintings. She was very detached from her work." When Frida came to the private viewing, it was to say: Look at who I am; I am in pain and I want to live, and I paint my pain. I make it visible.

The year 1939 was a difficult one for Frida Kahlo. Her unfaithful husband, Diego Rivera, publicly announced that he planned to divorce her, while at the same time having an affair with her younger sister, Cristina. Frida had, until the previous year, been little more than Diego’s wife, but an exhibition at the Julien Levy in NYC brought her attention outside of Mexico. Diego encouraged her to display her art in Paris, to gain her greater exposure in the modern art capital of the world but also so he could more freely continue his relationship with Cristina. That year André Breton, the father of surrealism, and his wife Jacqueline Lamba spent several months with Frida and Diego in their famed Casa Azul, and since Breton considered Frida as the embodiment of surrealism itself he invited Frida to stay with them while he made preparations to have her work displayed there. (Of note, Frida rejected the surrealist label, and found Breton and most of the surrealists to be pompous asses.)

Fascism was progressively taking over western Europe in early 1939, as the Republicans were about to lose power to the Francisco Franco and the Nationalists, aided by fascist regimes in Germany, Italy and Portugal, Czechoslovakia and Poland would soon fall to Hitler, and the Nazis were in the process of invading France, which was deeply upsetting to Frida and those closest to her.

Frida was also in her constant pain, due mainly to the bus-trolley accident in 1926 that nearly claimed her life and horribly pierced her body. She did consult multiple specialists in New York and Paris and underwent multiple operations, without much improvement.

Marc Petitjean, the author of this book, and the son of Michel Petitjean, one of Frida’s lovers, and this relationship provides an often interesting but somewhat uneven account of an important period in Frida Kahlo’s life. Frida’s painting The Heart was a gift to Michel, and one that was constantly on view in the Petitjean home throughout Marc’s life. In it, Frida portrays a dress from her youth, an image of her with a rod piercing her heart, presumably the one from the trolley that impaled her, but that rod went through her pelvis, and a traditional dress that helped to hide the misshaped legs that resulted from an episode of paralytic polio she suffered at the age of six.

Marc, Michel’s father, was approached by a researcher in Mexico who wanted to review whatever letters and other communication that Michel had about his father, and since Marc was interested in Michel, and his relationship to Frida, he readily agreed. This book is a compilation of what information he obtained from different sources in Paris and France, along with information that Oscar shared with him. Michel’s life is far more banal than Frida’s, and Marc puts his father on a lofty pedestal, especially in comparison to Breton and the other surrealists, and there seem to be occasional embellishments and likely inaccuracies, particularly when he portrays the lovers engaged in an intimate conversation, when the author states earlier in the book that his father spoke little useful English and Frida spoke hardly any French.

I would recommend The Heart: Frida Kahlo in Paris to anyone who wishes to learn more about this great artist’s life in detail, but I would take it with a large pinch of salt, and look for other sources about the time she spent in Paris that year to the casual reader.

46AlisonY
Mai 9, 3:01 pm

>45 kidzdoc: Really enjoyed that review, Darryl. I learnt a lot and you piqued my interest in Kahlo.

47kjuliff
Mai 9, 6:16 pm

>44 kidzdoc: Enticing review! I think either Crooked Plow or Kairos will take the prize. I haven’t been able to read Crooked Plow but from LT reviews I expect it will win. I was disappointed in Kairos which is not one of Erpenbeck’s best, but it seems to have been liked by readers who have not read her other novels.

48rv1988
Mai 9, 9:16 pm

>45 kidzdoc: A wonderful and detailed review, this seems like an interesting book - although I note your warnings about taking it with a pinch of salt.

49kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Mai 10, 7:39 pm

>46 AlisonY: Thanks, Alison! I want to learn more about Frida Kahlo, both from books written about her, and from recent movies and documentaries about her.

>47 kjuliff: Thanks, Kate. I'll read Kairos relatively soon, but I would like to get to Let Us Descend by Jesmyn Ward and James this month first, and The Heaven & Earth Grocery Store by James McBride in June for the Literary Fiction by People of Color group in Goodreads, which is the group's book of the month.

>48 rv1988: Thanks, Rasdhar. I don't recall reading any books especially about Frida Kahlo, so I don't have anything other than The Heart: Frida Kahlo in Paris to compare them to. I would assume that other books are more historically accurate, though.

50Dilara86
Mai 11, 1:44 am

>44 kidzdoc: Crooked Plow has been in my wishlist for some time, but your review really made me want to read it sooner rather than later!

51kidzdoc
Mai 11, 12:03 pm

>50 Dilara86: Thanks, Dilara!

52benitastrnad
Mai 12, 1:05 am

>49 kidzdoc:
I keep trying to get a recorded version of Heaven& Earth Grocery Store from the library to listen to on one of my frequent trips home and it is always checked out. I do want to read this one because I like the other books my James McBride that I have read.

53tangledthread
Mai 12, 12:52 pm

>49 kidzdoc: Our book group discussed Heaven & Earth Grocery Store a week ago. We talked about it for 2 hours and could have gone longer. Everyone had their own favorite characters, scenes, and plot devices.
Hope your experience is as enriching.

54kidzdoc
Mai 14, 12:43 pm

>52 benitastrnad: To my great surprise I have not read anything by James McBride! I started reading The Color of Water many years ago but never finished it. Apparently The Free Library of Philadelphia has over a dozen print copies of The Heaven & Earth Grocery Store, so I'll plan to request a copy during the last week of this month, as I want to finish Let Us Descend and James first.

>53 tangledthread: That sounds great, tangledthread! This will be the first time I participate in a group read on Goodreads, so hopefully it will go well.

55labfs39
Bearbeitet: Mai 14, 12:49 pm

>54 kidzdoc: I loved The Color of Water and have Heaven & Earth Grocery Store on my read-next bookcase.

ETA: PS the audiobook of CoW is excellent.

56streamsong
Mai 14, 1:24 pm

Hi Darryl - One of my in person bookclubs will be reading Heaven & Earth Grocery Store this year. I have also not read anything by James McBride. The titles are so familiar, but I have just not taken that next step :) .

>55 labfs39: Thank you for commenting on the audiobook of CoW. I enjoy audiobooks in my car as it is an hour's drive to the nearest largish town.

57jessibud2
Mai 14, 1:40 pm

>55 labfs39: - I agree that The Colour of Water on audio is excellent! Narrated by the late great Andre Braugher.

58kidzdoc
Mai 14, 1:44 pm

>55 labfs39: Sounds good, Lisa. Since The Color of Water was published in 1995 I assume that I tried to read it when I was a medical student or pediatric resident, periods of time when I hardly read anything for pleasure, due to my busy schedules.

Do you ?still subscribe to Archipelago Books? I was pleased to receive a copy of The Joyful Song of the Partridge by Paulina Chiziane, the first Mozambican female author to have a book published. I enjoyed her first novel The First Wife: A Tale of Polygamy, and the description of this book sounds even better. I also received a copy of A Question of Belonging, a collection of chronicles by the Argentinian author Hebe Uhart, which looks good as well.

>56 streamsong: I'm not sure why I haven't read anything by James McBride, Janet. I've read good comments and reviews about Deacon King Kong and The Good Lord Bird, but I simply haven't gotten to them yet. My reading output took a nose drive a year or two before the pandemic, and it remains far below what it was before then, when I had no problem finishing 75 books in a year. I'm doing a bit better this year, but it will be a struggle to finish 50 books by year's end.

59labfs39
Mai 14, 8:21 pm

>57 jessibud2: Oh, that's interesting, as my audio version was narrated by JD Jackson and Susan Denaker. I thought it worked well having a man read the chapters from James' POV, and a woman for the chapters from his mother's. Both were exceptional. Good to know that other narrators did an equally good job. Perhaps a sign of the quality of the writing too?

>58 kidzdoc: I don't subscribe to AP, but I do place orders periodically. There are still many titles in their back catalogs that I would like to read. I love the physical quality of Archipelago books, as well as the quality of the translations. I support them as often as I can.

I read The First Wife last year and enjoyed it quite a bit as well. I would definitely read more by her.

60jessibud2
Mai 14, 8:49 pm

>59 labfs39: - I would listen to Andre Braugher read the phone book, lol! His voice was such that I didn't want to get out of my car!! (I used to listen to audiobooks in my car on my commute to and from work).

61kidzdoc
Mai 14, 9:11 pm

>57 jessibud2: I had forgotten that Andre Braugher died, or maybe I didn't know. Either way that is a great loss.

>59 labfs39: Ah. I thought it was you who had a subscription to Archipelago Books, but maybe it's someone else in Club Read.

>60 jessibud2: I'm with you, Shelley!

62mabith
Bearbeitet: Mai 17, 11:09 am

Definitely adding Crooked Plow to my to-read list.

I read The Heart: Frida Kahlo in Paris a couple years ago, with much the same reaction to yours. Some interesting parts but a fair bit from the author that also had my saying Hmm, not sure about that, or thinking about his personal motivations.

63kidzdoc
Mai 15, 4:53 pm

>62 mabith: Right, Meredith. Marc Petitjean's account was a very biased one, IMO, and he and the book would have been better served by a more critical set of eyes. I'm not sorry that I read it, though.

64benitastrnad
Mai 17, 11:33 pm

I have been busy packing for the last month. I haven't been working too hard on it and am concentrating on packing my books. I packed 12 boxes in the last two weeks and got them all entered into librarything and my data base so that I know what books are where. I will be headed to Kansas on Sunday with a carload. I got my upholstered chair into the Outback and now I will have to put my suitcase in the passenger seat. I am also taking some of my smaller kitchen appliances - my mixer, blender, and small food processor. I will be there two weeks then back here to Alabama where the book packing and clothes culling will continue. I plan on moving out of Alabama sometime between October 10 - 15. My landlord called this week and I gave her those dates as being firm. I hate the work but I do have to say that I am looking forward to moving back to Kansas. There is lots of moving and cleaning to do in Kansas and I will devote the month of July to that. I am going to take a vacation in September and then wait for the moving truck for the rest of the moving chores.

65kidzdoc
Mai 18, 4:20 pm

>64 benitastrnad: I like your slow but steady approach of moving from Alabama to Kansas, Benita!

66kidzdoc
Mai 19, 1:15 pm

Is anyone confident that Joe Biden will win re-election in November? As the weeks go on I'm increasingly more certain that he's going to blow it, which mimics the same sense I had that Hillary Clinton was going to lose in 2016 but even worse this time around. If you are confident in Biden please say so, as I need some cheering up.

67RidgewayGirl
Mai 19, 4:40 pm

Every single special election between the mid-terms and now have gone to the Democrats, often by surprising margins. I think it comes down to voter turn-out and the Democrats have the advantage of money, volunteers and infrastructure. There are already field offices across swing states, while the GOP has fired those who knew how to do the work. I don't think it's certain, since nothing is, but I think the results will be far better than expected.

68KeithChaffee
Mai 19, 5:02 pm

The optimist in me says that it's hard to imagine Trump winning over many voters who didn't vote for him in 2020, and it seems likely to me that the news of the next few months can only drive more away from him. (If he's convicted in the NY business records case, he'll lose some votes; if he's not, I don't think that gains him any votes.)

Nothing seems likely to chase the Trump diehards away in large numbers, but in an election as close as this one is likely to be, large numbers aren't necessary. And >67 RidgewayGirl: is correct that recent elections are an encouraging sign.

But Biden himself hasn't been on the ballot in any of those elections, and the polling suggests that Biden personally may be the problem; he's running well behind the Democratic Senate candidates in several of the swing states.

The general improvement in the economy isn't noticed by many voters; if you weren't one of the folks who lost their jobs when unemployment was high, and 85% of people weren't -- unemployment peaked at about 15% at the beginning of COVID -- then you don't really notice when unemployment goes down because that doesn't change your life. But everyone notices inflation, especially at the grocery store. Biden would be doing better if unemployment were moderately high and inflation were very low instead of the other way around.

It's a wildly volatile and unpredictable election; I can imagine the popular vote landing anywhere from Trump +5 to Biden +10, and Biden probably needs to win by at least 3-4 points to win the electoral college. I think it's more likely that the election will be lost by a candidate doing something stupid/appalling than it will be won by persuasion, and I think Trump is far more likely to do something stupid/appalling, so if I were forced to bet, I'd bet on Biden. But I wouldn't bet a lot.

69kjuliff
Mai 19, 7:08 pm

>66 kidzdoc: I’m sorry to say I have the same fears as you, and they are increasing daily. I would love to be able to cheer you up. My fears started with 1/6/2020.

I think Biden is losing the Hispanic vote.

70benitastrnad
Mai 19, 8:16 pm

I think that Joe Biden will win but it will be a squeaker. Biden is too mild mannered and that makes it appear that he is physically weak. He is Joe Cool and people don't like that. They want the bluster and bombast of that orange haired gasbag. Biden needs to get out and campaign. He needs to set Kamila free to give any and all speeches she wants to. The democrats need to get out the vote. Like somebody said earlier, the Democrats are doing well in the special elections that are being held. A Democrat woman won a state of Alabama Senate seat that has been Republican since the 1980's - and she won it by a landslide. She did it by concentrating on women's rights and the people of that district agreed with her.

I also agree that those people who didn't vote for Trump in 2020 aren't going to vote for him again, but the Democrats have to get out the vote.

71qebo
Mai 20, 2:48 pm

>66 kidzdoc: I am not at all confident, sorry. However, I don't think it is fair to place the entire blame on either Joe Biden or Hillary Clinton for losing. Both are flawed but in fairly standard ways, and I'm unconvinced that substitutes would fare significantly differently. We live in strange times.

>68 KeithChaffee: more likely that the election will be lost by a candidate doing something stupid/appalling
Trump has been doing appalling things for 8 years and yet a substantial portion of voters view this as a feature.

72KeithChaffee
Mai 20, 4:33 pm

>71 qebo: Both are flawed but in fairly standard ways

I always liked the way Republican pundit/satirist P. J. O'Rourke put it when he endorsed Clinton over Trump: "She's wrong about absolutely everything, but she's wrong within normal parameters." (Not that I agree with O'Rourke that Clinton was wrong about everything, mind you.)

>71 qebo: Trump has been doing appalling things for 8 years and yet a substantial portion of voters view this as a feature.

Yeah, I know. But I think each appalling thing he does shaves off another sliver of support, and in a close race, every little sliver makes a difference.

73rocketjk
Mai 21, 9:58 am

>71 qebo: "I am not at all confident, sorry. However, I don't think it is fair to place the entire blame on either Joe Biden or Hillary Clinton for losing. Both are flawed but in fairly standard ways, and I'm unconvinced that substitutes would fare significantly differently. We live in strange times."

This is basically how I feel, as well. After my wife and I get back from our "California and back" summer, we're both going to spend as much time as we can this autumn election volunteering.

74kjuliff
Mai 21, 9:46 pm

>73 rocketjk: Yes that’s *exactly* what I feel. I am also concerned about those politicians that are influenced by and copying him. I’ve been reading about Argentina’s Milei. I find it unbelievable that such people are actually believed by large minorities.

On another point, I think those who are confident that Trump will be defeated - as I was in 2020 - may not be in touch with those people who are now supporting him. Im finding the very people who I’d expect to oppose him, are so disillusioned with Biden, and in NYC with Eric Adam’s, that they are thinking of changing their vote TO Trump.

75benitastrnad
Mai 23, 11:14 am

>74 kjuliff:
The disappointment in Biden is one of the things I don't understand. Haven't these people been following the news. Biden has gotten so much through Congress that I thought was impossible (the Infrastructure Bill for one), his support of the industry unions that has been so visible and active for another. People who are disappointed in Biden have two problems. 1) they don't understand that Congress is the lawmaking body in the U.S. and until Moscow/Koch Brothers Mitch and co. are gone there will be no movement of anything through Congress. It is the Republicans in Congress that are blocking things. This is why it is so important that Democrats start winning in Congress. Until there is a majority of Democrats in Congress nothing is going to change. Look at the recent try that moderate Republicans made in Congress regarding immigration laws. A well respected Republican junior senator from Oklahoma and a Democrat senator wrote a bill that had many improvements from both parties. What happened? The Republican leadership refused to back it because Trump said no. He doesn't want anything to go through Congress. He would rather make the people of the U.S. wait and wait until he can ride in on a white horse and say that it is all because of him. Just like Adolph Hitler in 1932. 2) there is a hatred of Kamila Harris. No way, no how will a black woman ever be president. That fact alone is one reason why every minority in the U.S. should vote for Biden. So what if Biden is old. We have a competent fallback that is built into the constitution and in this case that fallback is Kamila Harris.

I think we have a competent team in the President and Vice-President. Now we need to work on Congress. One way to do that is to keep pushing women's rights.

76kjuliff
Mai 23, 12:22 pm

>75 benitastrnad: they don't understand that Congress is the lawmaking body in the U.S..

That’s precisely it. That’s one of the problems with a presidential system - it requires the public to understand hov the country is governed.
Many immigrants, particularly older ones didn’t get a basic education, and many underprivileged born-in-America Americans somehow missed out.

In Australia and the UK there’s also a lot of ignorance, but when the Aussies and Brits go to the ballot box, they (unless they are in the current PM’s electorate), they do not even see a PM on the ballot paper. Also they are handed out “How to Vote” cards outside polling booths by volunteer members of the parties so voting is easy. I still have probs voting in NYC.

I mix with uneducated adults. They are used to South American dictatorships. I’ve campaigned in Harlem for the 2020 election. I know it’s a small sample but every person I approached told me thank you but Obama will get a third term!!! Most were not bothering to vote and wouldn’t take the registration card I tried to hand them.

If you are visiting a hospital talk to the janitors. Talk to the uneducated.

Look at the socio-economic groups of Trump voters

It’s about lack of education. That’s why we, myself included got it wrong last Federal election, and the non-Trump and many Republicans will get it wrong again.

It never ceases to amaze me when Americans tell me that the U.S. is the greatest democracy on earth.

77KeithChaffee
Mai 23, 3:10 pm

>75 benitastrnad: The disappointment in Biden is one of the things I don't understand.

Part of the problem is that he's fixed the wrong thing, at least as far as the economy goes. Unemployment is very low, but he doesn't get credit for that because it doesn't effect most people. At its worst, during the early months of COVID, unemployment peaked around 15%, which means that 85% of people weren't unemployed, so they didn't gain anything or see any change as unemployment dropped to historic lows.

Inflation, on the other hand? Everyone notices that, and even when the inflation rate drops, as it has under Biden, prices are still going up, just more slowly. And the prices will never drop back to where they were before the period of high inflation. (And you wouldn't want them to. Deflation is its own bucket of economic misery.)

He'd be better off if he'd had steadily low inflation and modestly high unemployment instead of the other way around. Presidents pay a higher price for even mild inflation than they do for severe unemployment.

the Infrastructure Bill for one

But like a lot of Biden's legislative accomplishments, the results from that will take a while to be felt. It takes time to even start the work on highways (and schools and rail tracks and hospitals...), much less to have finished projects for people to benefit from. Maybe a few construction projects will begin before the end of Biden's current term, but most of the benefits won't be felt until at least the middle of the next presidential term.

78benitastrnad
Mai 23, 4:18 pm

>77 KeithChaffee:
Most of the benefits won't be felt until at least the middle of the next presidential term.
I agree with that. Planning for the long term never gains anybody much. Even when its for your own retirement plan. :-)

79kjuliff
Mai 23, 4:32 pm

>75 benitastrnad: It is the Republicans in Congress that are blocking things.

That’s correct and that they are doing so is in part due to their fear of Trump, and also because of unelected lobby groups. But so many do not understand this and blame Biden for the consequences.

80kidzdoc
Mai 25, 11:57 am

Thanks for your great comments, everyone. My post in >66 kidzdoc: was due mainly to a series of polls that showed Biden losing five of six swing states, including here in Pennsylvania. Voters of color, especially Black and Latino, seem to be far less enthusiastic about Biden, and a good chunk of Latino voters have expressed support for Trump, and younger voters and progressives are opposed to Biden's support for the immoral Netanyahu government and the worsening humanitarian crisis in Palestine; I'm also deeply opposed to his stance and, at this point, I can't completely guarantee that I'll vote for Biden in November, although I certainly won't vote for Trump. (I'm looking seriously at Cornel West; he obviously won't win the general election, but he does represent my personal values much more than Biden does, especially in regards to Israel.) Two years ago I (and I'm sure many others) thought that the Democratic Party should have spent time grooming a potential candidate to run against Trump in 2024, someone younger, more energetic, and more likely to appeal to the base. Instead they stuck with Biden, and, IMO, barring some significant shift in the race they will hand the White House back to Trump.

I hope that I'm wrong, and being overly pessimistic, but I just don't see any way that Biden can win in November.

81RidgewayGirl
Mai 25, 12:10 pm

>80 kidzdoc: We're a democracy, albeit a flawed one, and the results of the election will be what we, the people want. Each person's vote is their sacred responsibility. I'm a little sad to not be in a swing state, but I'll still be making calls and sending out postcards and donating and reminding my friends to vote. I refuse to give up, even if it feels hopeless, but I certainly understand that many people don't think it's worth bothering.

82kjuliff
Mai 25, 12:27 pm

Voters of color, especially Black and Latino, seem to be far less enthusiastic about Biden, and a good chunk of Latino voters have expressed support for Trump,

This is the feeling I’m getting from these two groups. I was surprised that many Latino voters have swung to Trump because of his immigration policies. Busing undocumented immigrants to NYC was a cunning political ploy by the Republicans.

83kjuliff
Mai 25, 12:30 pm

>81 RidgewayGirl: My hopefully misplaced fear is what Trump presidency could do to our democracy.

84RidgewayGirl
Mai 25, 12:37 pm

>83 kjuliff: That would be it for a long while, longer than my lifetime. But beyond doing my part, I have no control. Strangely, participating by volunteering makes me more optimistic, mainly by being around others willing to take positive action and be hopeful. And having lived in SC, I'm used to volunteering for a campaign and then watching my candidate lose, it's still better than not participating.

85kidzdoc
Mai 25, 12:40 pm

On a much brighter note, yesterday morning I finished what will be one of my favorite books of 2024, Medgar & Myrlie: The Love Story That Awakened America by Joy-Ann Reid, which was a gift book from Harriett's Bookshop in Philadelphia, one of my two favorite indie bookstores in the city. I had gone there twice with my cousin, but the shop was closed both times. I contacted them by email to complain privately, and found out that the owner had recently had major abdominal surgery, and was instructed to remain in bed for several weeks. I felt horrible and apologized profusely, but she still sent this book, as she realized that I was one of the bookshop's most frequent customers. I'll pass this on to my cousin, and I'll pass this on to my cousin the next time I see her.



I met up with Liz in Philadelphia for a few hours on Tuesday, and we stopped into my other favorite indie bookshop in the city, Head House Books in Society Hill. I left with four books, all of which were on my wish list:

The Need for Roots by Simone Weil: The best known book by the French philosopher, which argues that we are all bound by eternal obligations towards each other in a shared community that descends physical boundaries or ethnic/racial backgrounds.

Long Island by Colm Tóibín: The sequel to Brooklyn, a novel which I absolutely loved.

Yellowface by R.F. Kuang: A razor sharp satire in which a marginally talented White female author (June) who is friends with a far more gifted Chinese American writer (Athena) decides to submit her friend's work to her publisher after Athena's death in a freak accident, but June claims it as being her own work. The lie is progressively more perpetuated, as a new publisher changes her name to an Asian one, and June/Juniper takes progressively greater steps to preserve her reputation, in a monstrous and pathetic effort of cultural misappropriation. My friend Fliss, a former member of the 75 Books group, told me this morning that she loved and read it, and since this is AAPI (Asian American and Pacific Islander) Heritage Month I'll put aside James for the moment, as I haven't started it yet, and finish this book by early next week.

My Friends by Hisham Matar: A novel about a young man from the Libyan city of Benghazi who is deeply moved by a short story he heard on the radio, so much so that he decided to study abroad at the University of Edinburgh. In doing so he embraces being able to live in a far more open society, but while participating in a protest against the Qaddafi regime he is critically injured. He moves to Paris, where he meets the author of the short story, and the two young men develop a deep friendship, and their conversations lead him to return to his homeland to participate in the Arab Spring that aims to deliver democracy to the Libyan people.

I also borrowed a book from my local branch of the Free Library of Philadelphia, My Father's Brain: Life in the Shadow of Alzheimer's by Sandeep Jauhar, and one of my former work partners sent me another book, Bitter Crop: The Heartache and Triumph of Billie Holiday's Last Year by Paul Alexander.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I have a lot of reading to do...

86kidzdoc
Mai 25, 1:00 pm

>81 RidgewayGirl: I'll still vote, Kay, as I view that as an all but sacred responsibility, especially considering that my mother, her sister, and their parents lived for at least sometime in south Alabama, during a time when my grandparents only received "education" in segregated and far inferior schools and were unable to vote until they moved to NYC during the end of World War II. I've voted in essentially every election since 1980, the first year that I could, and certainly every major one; I think I missed one relatively minor election about 8-10 years ago when I lived in Atlanta. My grandmother wanted to bring me to the March on Washington in 1963 but my mother refused, because I was only 2 years old at the time. I've said for many years that not voting would be akin to urinating on my grandmother's grave, and that won't change because I'm not optimistic about the result of an election.

I can only hope that we still have a democracy after Trump is re-elected.

>82 kjuliff: What I've read indicates that many Latinos are opposed to illegal immigration. To me this is quite hypocritical, as hundreds of thousands of Cubans emigrated to this country on boats, during the Cuban Revolution in the late 1950s and early 1960s, and in subsequent periods during the 1980s and 1990s.

>83 kjuliff: I agree, Kate. Trump will likely have a Supreme Court, Senate and House of Representatives in his back pocket, who are willing to do his bidding, and I fear what harm they would unleash on our democratic norms.

>84 RidgewayGirl: I wish I could share your optimism, Kay. I do agree that it's better to participate, although caring for my mother will likely keep me from doing anything substantial. I live close enough to Philadelphia (about 5-6 miles north of Northeast Philadelphia), so I conceivably could call or write in "Get Out the Vote" campaigns.

87kjuliff
Mai 25, 1:26 pm

>86 kidzdoc: Yes it is hypercritical of Latinos to support Trump’s stand on immigration. I’ve tried explaining this to those I know. I’ve used logic and can get nowhere. The typical response is, “but it’s different now”.

88LolaWalser
Bearbeitet: Mai 25, 2:32 pm

>81 RidgewayGirl:

the results of the election will be what we, the people want.

As we have seen a number of times in the past, not necessarily -- given that popular vote, the direct expression of every individual voter's choice, may still be depreciated and the loser get the presidency.

>86 kidzdoc:

Cubans were (and are) readily taken in by the US because rich and poor, it serves the anti-Communist propaganda. There will always be room for Cubans in the US. Latinos aren't cohesive as a group and different nationalities don't necessarily feel solidarity for each other.

89KeithChaffee
Mai 25, 3:12 pm

>80 kidzdoc: I'm looking seriously at Cornel West

I'm not normally one to grumble about whatever electoral choices people make, but democracy is literally on the line here, so I will: There are only two candidates with a chance to be elected president. A vote for anyone other than Joe Biden is a vote for Donald Trump. This is not an election in which a third-party protest vote can be justified.

90KeithChaffee
Mai 25, 3:17 pm

88> given that popular vote, the direct expression of every individual voter's choice, may still be depreciated and the loser get the presidency.

We don't elect the president by popular vote; winning the popular vote may feel nice, but it's irrelevant. If you win the electoral college, even if you have fewer popular votes, you are not "the loser;" you are the winner.

You might think (and I would agree with you) that we should elect the president by popular vote, but we don't, and people really need to get over the idea that the popular vote has anything to do with who wins or loses.

91kjuliff
Mai 25, 3:23 pm

>89 KeithChaffee: I was about to write something similar. I had thought of not voting at all as a solution, but realize that doing so would be a vote for Trump. I was sort of feeling safe about not voting as a protest because I live in NYC and Democratic presidential candidates are considered safe bets. But after Trump’s enthusiastic greeting in the Bronx last week I’m not so sure.

92japaul22
Mai 25, 3:28 pm

I'm excited about Long Island, too! I think I will reread Brooklyn in June since my library hold for Long Island should be ready in early July.

93LolaWalser
Mai 25, 4:24 pm

>90 KeithChaffee:

I was addressing this: "the results of the election will be what we, the people want."

Patently, the popular vote IS an expression of "what the people want" and patently, when it is at odds with the electoral college, "what people want" is overruled.

Now, if you want to argue that people (numbering in millions) whose vote is thus trashed are bothering about something "irrelevant", that's your prerogative.

94KeithChaffee
Mai 25, 5:02 pm

>93 LolaWalser: The key phrase there is "an expression of 'what the people want'". The electoral vote is also an expression of what the people want, just calculated in a different way. No one's vote is "trashed" in an electoral vote; they're all counted toward the results in their state. (Again, though, I agree with you that a direct popular vote would be preferable.)

95LolaWalser
Mai 25, 9:04 pm

>94 KeithChaffee:

This is getting WEIRD.

No, the "key" phrase is the text I quoted and addressed:

the results of the election will be what we, the people want.

Kindly don't try to sell me the notion that Trump's victory (to take but the latest example) was "what the people wanted". (As if my personal opinion even mattered--look up some of what your compatriots had to say on the topic!)

The electoral vote is also an expression of what the people want, just calculated in a different way.

LOL, no. That's... not even sophistry. The majority of Americans have in fact been wanting a change to your thievin', stealin' system for decades, here's a poll from just the last year:

Majority of Americans continue to favor moving away from Electoral College

Nearly two-thirds of U.S. adults (65%) say the way the president is elected should be changed so that the winner of the popular vote nationwide wins the presidency. A third favor keeping the current Electoral College system.


No one's vote is "trashed" in an electoral vote; they're all counted toward the results in their state.

Counted in their state; depreciated, trashed, voided in the competition for the presidency. Look, I'm not the Columbus of these arguments, it's a debate raging for over a century in your own country. I'd save the apologetics for your compatriots, the two-thirds who disagree.

96kjuliff
Bearbeitet: Mai 26, 12:34 am

>84 RidgewayGirl: I agree in participating. Until I became chronically ill I used to campaign in all Federal elections, both here and in Australia. I was thinking earlier that the last time I campaigned was in 2020, but of course it was in 2016. I’ve done the telephone calling and the street walking. I prefer the latter. My last campaigning effort was to try to get people to register to vote in east Harlem. It was a bit depressing actually as I remember now only one person even took a form. Everyone was very friendly and anti Trump, but they seemed to feel no need to register.

97rocketjk
Mai 26, 10:13 am

>96 kjuliff: "I agree in participating."

My wife and I were introduced through a friend to an advocacy organization called the Voter Movement Project (https://movement.vote/about/). They support grass-roots organizations and election campaigns up and down the ballot, partner with other grass-roots advocacy groups, and help steer interested people to volunteer opportunities in needed areas. We hope to get back to NYC in mid-August, at which point we will be connecting with MVP to see where our volunteer efforts might be, we hope, useful. I tried the phone calling in 2020 and found it dreary. I'll be looking for something else to do!

Your experience in East Harlem does sound discouraging. I did a bit of the same in Mendocino County in 2020. We had a retired labor organizer who parked his van in different spots around the county (which is huge: about the size of Rhode Island, but with only around 100,000 people in it) and used it for voter registration and campaign literature distribution. On the days he was parked in my town I would spend the day lending a hand. Nothing like East Harlem, of course, but we did manage to register a few folks along the way. Being in a very rural area, we did get some guff from Trumpers, but nothing too harsh. "Biden's an idiot and so are you!" was about the worst of it that I can recall.

98kjuliff
Mai 26, 11:23 am

>97 rocketjk: I too find the phone calling dreary. I also think it can annoy people because I don’t like getting calls myself, and many like me just find them intrusive.

Although I used the word depressing for my East Harlem experiences I realise “discouraging” is a more apt description. I actually had great times. The people of East Harlem are very friendly people, as are most NEw Yorkers. They chatted a lot and had many questions. Unfortunately they just weren’t interested in registering. They seemed to just want to say funny things about Trump. Perhaps now more will feel the need to register.

99kidzdoc
Bearbeitet: Mai 26, 4:26 pm

My reading has certainly picked up over the past two months, as I finished Medgar & Myrlie: Medgar Evers and the Love Story That Awakened America by Joy-Ann Reid yesterday (5 stars, without question), and I put down Travelers to Unimaginable Lands: Stories of Dementia, the Caregiver and the Human Brain by Dasha Kiper about halfway through, as I was getting caught up in the psychoanalytic theories; I'll give it 3 stars for now and hopefully come back to it at some point.

>87 kjuliff: The Latino "community" is anything but monolithic, even within the same country or territory. My college roommate during my freshman year at Tulane was a White puertorriqueño from a well to do family, and his friends, especially the girls, looked at me with utter disgust, since I was African American. After a month or so he moved to an off campus apartment, and I was given a new roommate in the spring semester.

>88 LolaWalser: I agree regarding White Latinos, those who identify as White and not mestizo or Black, whether Cuban, Colombian, Puerto Rican, etc.

>89 KeithChaffee: There are only two candidates with a chance to be elected president. A vote for anyone other than Joe Biden is a vote for Donald Trump. This is not an election in which a third-party protest vote can be justified.

I reserve the right to decide who I wish to vote for, Keith, without being told in a dismissive manner that I must vote for Biden. I see nothing wrong with looking at all of the candidates for any office—this is a democracy after all—and deciding which one of them most closely fits my values. I did vote "Uncommitted" in the Pennsylvania primary election for POTUS, mainly due to Biden's unwillingness to cut off funding and other support to the war criminal Netanyahu, especially in regards to the one ton American made bombs that have claimed the lives of tens of thousands of innocent Palestinian women and children (as my user name indicates I'm a pediatrician, and the deaths of innocent children, whether Israeli or Palestinian, is absolutely unacceptable to me). That may not be enough for me to decide to vote for Cornel West, but I refuse to let anyone tell me who I should vote for. IMO the Democratic Party doesn't do much for the Black and Latino communities, and assumes that they will vote in large numbers for their candidates, especially POTUS. It's time for some new blood, and new ideas that will benefit these communities.

I never said that I won't vote for Biden; what I said was that I would take a close look at Cornel West, and I see absolutely nothing wrong with that.

>92 japaul22: Sounds good, Jennifer. It's been quite awhile since I read Brooklyn, so I would ideally like to read at least a detailed synopsis of it before I start Long Island.

100qebo
Mai 26, 5:24 pm

>80 kidzdoc: I'm looking seriously at Cornel West; he obviously won't win the general election, but he does represent my personal values much more than Biden does, especially in regards to Israel.

As a practical matter (in our frustratingly distorted voting system), a vote for not-Biden in a swing state is a vote for Trump. And on this single issue, your intent may be to express moral outrage, but the actual effect would be even worse Israel/Palestine policy, with Trump impatient for Israel to "get it over with" while Jared Kushner eyes "waterfront property" in Gaza.

>99 kidzdoc: I did vote "Uncommitted" in the Pennsylvania primary election
My nephew did too, for similar reasons. I considered and ultimately didn't, but I still wasn't 100% sure on the five minute walk to the polling station. For the general election I am not in doubt. I want to give AOC et al a shot to influence policy.

>99 kidzdoc: It's time for some new blood
Well I definitely agree with this!

101kjuliff
Bearbeitet: Mai 26, 6:06 pm

>99 kidzdoc: The Latino "community" is anything but monolithic Well I do know that this is true, just as Africans are not a monolithic community. I should have said, “those members of the Latino community who came to America due to economic, social and/or political discrimination”.

I will try to be more precise in future. Or perhaps bow out. This is typical of a problem of the old political left. Surely those contributing to this discussion are all on the same side, considering the original question that primed it. It’s obvious who Keith and I meant. Divide and conquer, a house divided etc etc.

102kjuliff
Mai 26, 5:52 pm

>99 kidzdoc: I reserve the right to decide who I wish to vote for, Keith, without being told in a dismissive manner that I must vote for Biden

Looks like Trump will win then, seeing as there is so much unnecessary discord amongst those of us who dislike his politics and lies. I didn’t see anything dismissive about Keith’s post. He was making a valid point. That’s the reality of not voting for Biden. Voting for anyone other than Biden is helping Trump. It’s unfortunate but true.

103KeithChaffee
Mai 26, 5:56 pm

>95 LolaWalser: Kindly don't try to sell me the notion that Trump's victory (to take but the latest example) was "what the people wanted".

If an election is so closely contested that the popular and electoral votes don't agree, I'm not sure you can say that "the people" have made any sort of clear statement about what they want. All they've told you is that they are sharply divided.

And when an election is that close -- and it was clear quite early that the 2016 election would be -- then it is even more important to remember that in any competition, you have to play the game by the rules that actually exist, not by the rules that you wish existed. You may hate the electoral college and wish for a popular vote to take its place (and, to repeat myself, I share that wish), but a candidate who fights to win the popular vote without paying attention to the electoral vote is playing the wrong game. You may be proud of all your touchdowns, but they genuinely are irrelevant when we're playing golf.

The Trump campaign in 2016 did a better job of playing by the rules that were in force, which is why Trump won and Clinton lost. And there is a reasonably good chance that he's going to beat Biden this fall in precisely the same way.

With that, I will join kjuliff in bowing out of this conversation, which is started to get a little too heated for this particular forum.

104kidzdoc
Mai 26, 8:23 pm

Yikes. What I thought was a fairly innocent post in >66 kidzdoc: has truly become weird, so I'll also bow out, and limit my future conversations to books, music and food.

105AlisonY
Bearbeitet: Mai 27, 4:09 pm

On a lighter note, also looking forward to the Brooklyn sequel. I'm delighted to see it getting great reviews this far. I'm going to try to save it for a couple of months as I think it has holiday read written all over it.

106kidzdoc
Mai 27, 9:41 am

>105 AlisonY: Same here, Alison. I'll probably read Long Island in the late summer or early autumn, unless I get a sudden urge to read it sooner.

Oh, wait...the Booker Prize longlist comes out in July, so I'll probably read it then if it makes the cut.

107benitastrnad
Mai 27, 2:21 pm

>104 kidzdoc:
I find it a sad fact that we can't talk about politics. Everything is political in a way, and I think it is good that you opened yourself and your thread to this kind of discussion. It is a risky thing to do because you go into it knowing that you have opened your thread and yourself to different opinions. The willingness to be that open is something I appreciate.

There are several statements here with which I don't agree, but I will stand by my opinion that we must all work to get out the vote. Only by voting do we make a difference. I lived in the South for 32 years and in that time I have come to realize how important a freedom it is to just be able to vote. I believe that if current trends continue that freedom will be lost. The only counter to that is to encourage and keep encouraging people to register and vote. The biggest fear that I have is that Kris Kobach and the Koch Brothers will continue to export their abhorrent opinions about voting, as they have done in Alabama. Kobach is the current attorney general in Kansas and he forced a statewide recount to prove that there was rampant abuse of voter registration. This cost the state 2.5 million dollars. In the end only 11 votes were found to be fraudulent. The recount is the kind of headline that keeps the Repulsicans in power and the minor story about the results of the recount gets little or no air time.

Please don't back away from political discussions. You can draw lines and enforce them on your thread, but it is important to me to know that there are people like you out there. I draw strength from that knowledge. So carry on! and Carry Forth. Like you - I need support.

108kidzdoc
Mai 28, 7:48 pm

>107 benitastrnad: Sorry, Benita; I will avoid discussing anything remotely political on my threads from now on, to steer clear of further discord.

I spent a lovely afternoon sitting on the rooftop terrace of my local library, where I devoured over 150 pages of My Father's Brain: Life in the Shadow of Alzheimer's by Sandeep Jauhar, which was absolutely superb; thanks to Shelley (jessibud2) for recommending it to me. I borrowed this copy from the Free Library of Philadelphia, so I'll write a review of it soon. My reading has picked up significantly over the past two months, but I'm falling behind on reviews again.